View Full Version : Finally rid of Vista!
MiniMatt
18-07-07, 02:04 AM
For the record, Vista isn't too keen on widescreen displays; it's really not keen at all dual widescreen displays; it's not a huge fan of Nvidia; it really loathes Nvidia's 7950 series, and throws a complete hissy fit at SLI configs; it also gets very grumpy with VPN clients. It also insists on asking "are you sure you really want to do this" about 15 bloody times every time I want to do something as simple as change the bloody properties of a shortcut.
So at about 22:30 last night I finally decided I'd had enough. In my younger days I quite liked tinkering about with betas, with figuring out obscure registry hacks (or INI hacks as they were back then) and generally messing around with the next big thing. Now I just want something that works. I'm sorry Microsoft, I tried, for three sodding months I endured this, the biggest pile of **** poor poo since Windows ME, and at 22:30 I finally gave up and formatted.
XP disc back in. Crap. Forgot the XP install process doesn't like RAID drives and you need to get the drivers on a floppy disc beforehand. Except my computer doesn't have a floppy drive and the motherboard doesn't even have a floppy header. So, fire up the other half's computer, download drivers, copy XP disc, slipstream drivers onto a new install, burn new disc, try again, success! About a hundred squillion critical updates later, finally, at 02:58 I'm finally back and running with a PC that just does what I need it to.
rictus01
18-07-07, 02:25 AM
Got to love it though, all those trend setters battling away to get the thing to work, priceless.
Hardware or software only get changed when they no longer do what I need and that's it, so normally they're well sorted by the time I get them, my sons gaming machine looks like a cross between a car radiator/ chav nova and a spaceship control system and he's always playing with it, me got a blue and grey box (and I thought that was fancy when I got it) and works reliabley most of the time, XP Pro on two machines, but the filestore still runs fine on 3.51, all but one of the network probes (laptops with sniffer software) run 98.
I won't be touching vista for a while yet I'm afraid, about the most is the one machine running XP in 64 bit mode.
Cheers Mark.
wyntrblue
18-07-07, 06:29 AM
vista was named wrong should be called ME the revenge. tho the beta of server 2008 is supprisingly good
SoulKiss
18-07-07, 07:18 AM
For the record, Vista isn't too keen on widescreen displays; it's really not keen at all dual widescreen displays; it's not a huge fan of Nvidia; it really loathes Nvidia's 7950 series, and throws a complete hissy fit at SLI configs; it also gets very grumpy with VPN clients. It also insists on asking "are you sure you really want to do this" about 15 bloody times every time I want to do something as simple as change the bloody properties of a shortcut.
So at about 22:30 last night I finally decided I'd had enough. In my younger days I quite liked tinkering about with betas, with figuring out obscure registry hacks (or INI hacks as they were back then) and generally messing around with the next big thing. Now I just want something that works. I'm sorry Microsoft, I tried, for three sodding months I endured this, the biggest pile of **** poor poo since Windows ME, and at 22:30 I finally gave up and formatted.
XP disc back in. Crap. Forgot the XP install process doesn't like RAID drives and you need to get the drivers on a floppy disc beforehand. Except my computer doesn't have a floppy drive and the motherboard doesn't even have a floppy header. So, fire up the other half's computer, download drivers, copy XP disc, slipstream drivers onto a new install, burn new disc, try again, success! About a hundred squillion critical updates later, finally, at 02:58 I'm finally back and running with a PC that just does what I need it to.
Poor Matt :)
I came to that conclusion after 3 days and wiped.
Just wasnt worth beta-testing for Microsoft.
As a coincidence, I too was installing XP last night - well running the System recovery disk on my laptop :)
rwoodcock01
18-07-07, 08:07 AM
Makes you feel better, I got sick of windows throwing a hissy fit on a Fujitsu tablet laptop I have.
intalled linux Ubuntu, worked first time, connected to the WPA wireless network nicely (there are a few problems with linux and WPA), playing any DVD with some extra minior configuration.
http://www.ubuntu.com/
Otherall a lovely experience, looks nice tweaked as well. I am using the Gnome but I intend to use Kbuntu which is a KDE version on a new build desktop for a bit of fun.
overall, an 8 out of 10 for the OS.
Cheers
Rich
Makes you feel better, I got sick of windows throwing a hissy fit on a Fujitsu tablet laptop I have.
intalled linux Ubuntu, worked first time, connected to the WPA wireless network nicely (there are a few problems with linux and WPA), playing any DVD with some extra minior configuration.
http://www.ubuntu.com/
Otherall a lovely experience, looks nice tweaked as well. I am using the Gnome but I intend to use Kbuntu which is a KDE version on a new build desktop for a bit of fun.
overall, an 8 out of 10 for the OS.
Cheers
Rich
Even easier, you can install ubuntu whilst Windows is running, reboot, and you have your OS. How easy is that? Check out Wubi (http://wubi-installer.org/).
Pedro68
18-07-07, 08:30 AM
I've used SUSE Linux (versions 6 & 9) and Mandrake 10 in place of various flavours of Windows.
Replaced Win98 with SUSE 6.2 but had to remove it because there were just too many configuration issues with my hardware :(
SUSE 9 was much better though ... but then XP came along :rolleyes:
Got sick of XP, so installed Mandrake 10, which was nice, but had one hell of a problem trying to get drivers for my USB ADSL Modem (supplied by Tiscali). Tiscali were about as much use as a chocolate teapot, and after hours of trawling the internet (dual boot machine thankfully!) eventually found a French site that contained some vague instructions and some drivers. When I finally got it working, it was great :)
Have only seen Vista briefly (on a PC I bought for a family member), and from what I saw it was very nice ... although it does have an annoying habit of telling me it's blocked a startup program from running ... its supposedly stopped the "Adobe download/update manager" from running?! But when I checked this in the configuration panel for "blocked startup programs" it shows as being NOT blocked and that it indeed HAS just run!?!
I have an old PC (given to me by the family member who's PC I replaced for them with a newer one), and might consider throwing some flavour of Linux on it instead of Windows ... IMO Linux is a much better OS - it's just not as popular due to the early days of useability problems (probably caused by most people being spoon-fed Windows-style).
That's no disrespect to Windows users - I've been a Windows user since 3.1 :confused: Thats how PC's should be - that is they should be easy to use, intuitive (not with Windows 3.1 on it!), and alas that's not what Linux was to begin with.
Pete
My old box had XP Pro on it - very good it was too.
New box has Vista Business Edition on it and seems to work okay...... the only issue I have it with M$ Word (Office 2007) when throws up an error and tries to restart itself when closing it. Most of my old software works just fine; just waiting for ZoneAlarm (free version) to be released so that I can ditch the OS's own firewall.
Got to say that, overall, I like it.
The Murder-in-Law has a swish new Dell PC with Vista "Home Basic" on it - seems to work okay too, but lacks a few things that my Vista has, but that's not a problem really.
That's no disrespect to Windows users - I've been a Windows user since 3.1 :confused: Thats how PC's should be - that is they should be easy to use, intuitive (not with Windows 3.1 on it!), and alas that's not what Linux was to begin with.
Pete
I remember my first ever Linux install. It was SuSE, but way before 6.x.
A friend had given me the CDs, saying "here, stick this in, boot, follow the screen, you'll love it."
It didn't detect my graphics chipset, meaning the GUI installer didn't run. It didn't detect my mouse, which was besides the point, since I was left sitting at a command prompt.
I didn't know any commands (not even 'ls'), and had to install an operating system using the manual supplied. That only detailled how to install with the GUI.
After a while of messing about, SuSE up & running, and working happily with my eth broadband modem. Thankfully.
That took me around 3 months to sort out, but I'm still a fan of Linux now.
wyrdness
18-07-07, 08:47 AM
Why do you think that I switched to a Mac? Everything just works.
If I hadn't gone for Mac, I'd certainly be using Ubuntu instead, as I'm a long-time Linux fan. The Mac was more for Mrs Wyrdness' convenience.
yep ubuntu here too, at least dual boot anyway.
Apparently the fastest growing version of linux is PCLINUX, mainly because its as easy to install as ubuntu but it comes with all the codexes and flash, and all the other built in video streamers that are so annoying to configure in ubuntu.
Apparently the fastest growing version of linux is PCLINUX, mainly because its as easy to install as ubuntu but it comes with all the codexes and flash, and all the other built in video streamers that are so annoying to configure in ubuntu.
The latest versions of either ubuntu or ubuntuStudio come with these too. ;)
rwoodcock01
18-07-07, 09:30 AM
The latest versions of either ubuntu or ubuntuStudio come with these too. ;)
You beat me to say that.
I am very tempted to dump windows in favour of linux, if it where not that I work in a trade where we use linux.
I am considering building a new 64bit PC and was considering giving Arch linux a go, anyone tried it?
http://www.archlinux.org/
Still not decided if GNONE or KDE is better than the other, figured I would use one or the other.
I consider Ubuntu and kbuntu as good entry level linux distro's i love the live CD option so that you can try it before you install.
What is the most advanced linux distro at the moment?
Cheers
Rich
Pedro68
18-07-07, 09:34 AM
Oh well that's that sorted then ... think I'll have to install PCLINUX on that old PC then :)
Cheers,
Pete
richbeales
18-07-07, 09:59 AM
http://distrowatch.com/
rwoodcock01
18-07-07, 11:04 AM
http://distrowatch.com/
Cheers for that.
Rich
on dual boot with XP Pro and UBUNTU these days
my only grief is I can't get hotmail on the mail client at the moment :(
that would be it and I would get rid of XP for good
MiniMatt
18-07-07, 11:20 AM
Oooh Rictus, NT3.51, with the exceptions of an icky IP stack and that strangeness with HPFS possibly MS' finest day :D I'm still tempted to believe that from a human usability perspective the old Windows 3.1(1) / NT3.(5)1 interface was and remains the best.
I keep tinkering with Linux but it's always been on the sidelines and as a result I've never really completely understood it, and I'm one of those people who just can't use something until I know how it works, be that mechanical or electrical. In hindsight, most of my Vista workarounds were googled rather than a result of deduction, and in hindsight I'm pretty sure I'd have less problems with linux +WINE than I did with Vista. Perhaps it's time to start learning stuff :D
same here MiniMatt but ubuntu is dead easy and I'm someone with NO previous knowledge in Linux
Right... If I had lots of cash to spare I'd have a mac... but my 3 year old PC is happy to run Ubuntu... So thats what its got.
My next big job is to merge Jax's and mine machines together, sort out a wireless keyboard and mouse, then loose the desks alltogether. Once that done it's output the Video to a big TFT.
Pedro68
18-07-07, 12:07 PM
on dual boot with XP Pro and UBUNTU these days
my only grief is I can't get hotmail on the mail client at the moment :(
that would be it and I would get rid of XP for good
I thought you couldn't get hotmail on ANY mail client :confused:
I used to quite happily access hotmail using Firefox on mandrake10 :smt045
I also used Trillian for Yahoo/ICQ/MSN (all at the same time sometimes :D )
Pete
well you can on outlook but yeah u're right
so i'm just trying to use it less till I get rid of it
well you can on outlook but yeah u're right
so i'm just trying to use it less till I get rid of it
Run Windows Live Mail (Desktop) under WinE, and kiss goodbye to Windows forever.
I would, if my choices weren't dictated by office politics.
Ubuntu here to. I only dual boot as I like to play alot of games which are not generally linux compatible.
I also dual boot at work as I am trialling Ubuntu for a work environment OS.
If games ran in linux (i know about Wine but its not really practical) then I probable woudlnt have had windows for years now.
Baph - as always - pls explain :) WinE? what's that ?:)
Pedro68
18-07-07, 12:48 PM
Hasn't anyone tried VMWare? Too expensive perhaps?
WinE used to be known by the longer name of "Windows Emulator" until uncle Bill threatened to sue IIRC. Now "Wine" is a recursive acronym meaning "Wine Is Not an Emulator" and is the name of the project that allows you to execute programs originally written to run on M$ Windows under Linux.
The difference between Wine and VMWare is that wine creates an "environment" in which to execute a program. No windows license required.
VMWare on the other hand creates a "virtual machine" and hence requires a license for each virtual machine OS used (unless you use Linux on all those virtual machines :P).
I last used VMWare a few years back, but it seemed pretty neat ... you could "switch" between machines at the click of a button :)
Pete
Baph - as always - pls explain :) WinE? what's that ?:)
Pretty much as Pedro68 said. Except he missed pointing you to their website. http://www.winehq.org/
Basically, run WinE, and you can run Windows applications, under Linux. Essentially all it does is map the Windows API to the corresponding functions under Linux.
Works well so it does. I've even see Half Life 2 (windows "required") running under WinE. On the same (dual boot) machine, it ran with a higher FPS in WinE than it did in Windows.
Last time I used it, it was a bit of a pain trying to configure different applications to run right though. But a little playing around, and you're good to go. From memory, you can even configure a Launcher (shortcut) to fire a given app under WinE straight away.
For those thinking about VMWare, check out Xen instead. ;)
timwilky
18-07-07, 12:59 PM
Hasn't anyone tried VMWare? Too expensive perhaps?
WinE used to be known by the longer name of "Windows Emulator" until uncle Bill threatened to sue IIRC. Now "Wine" is a recursive acronym meaning "Wine Is Not an Emulator" and is the name of the project that allows you to execute programs originally written to run on M$ Windows under Linux.
The difference between Wine and VMWare is that wine creates an "environment" in which to execute a program. No windows license required.
VMWare on the other hand creates a "virtual machine" and hence requires a license for each virtual machine OS used (unless you use Linux on all those virtual machines :P).
I last used VMWare a few years back, but it seemed pretty neat ... you could "switch" between machines at the click of a button :)
Pete
I use vmware on my development laptop. Works well, I have a server 2003 and a RHES install currently running under it. Then again my company runs quite a few vmware ESX setups and it is the default solution unless I can prove my applications will not work within a virtual solution. So same rule applies. I cannot justify and do not want to carry 3 laptops. what I do have though is a 300gb SATA drive in a 3.5" external box to support the data storage need. so also have a sata card installed
I shall give it a try - have seen refs to it before but never tried it
timwilky
18-07-07, 01:01 PM
Pretty much as Pedro68 said. Except he missed pointing you to their website. http://www.winehq.org/
Basically, run WinE, and you can run Windows applications, under Linux. Essentially all it does is map the Windows API to the corresponding functions under Linux.
Works well so it does. I've even see Half Life 2 (windows "required") running under WinE. On the same (dual boot) machine, it ran with a higher FPS in WinE than it did in Windows.
Last time I used it, it was a bit of a pain trying to configure different applications to run right though. But a little playing around, and you're good to go. From memory, you can even configure a Launcher (shortcut) to fire a given app under WinE straight away.
For those thinking about VMWare, check out Xen instead. ;)
The problem I have with wine was an assumption that there would be other micro$oft apps there. My only need for it was because Lotus did not provide a linux client so I had to run it through wine. Problem then I could not figure out how to then launch appropriate open office apps when it wanted to launch office apps etc.
The problem I have with wine was an assumption that there would be other micro$oft apps there. My only need for it was because Lotus did not provide a linux client so I had to run it through wine. Problem then I could not figure out how to then launch appropriate open office apps when it wanted to launch office apps etc.
Why were you trying to run OOffice apps under WinE? They run natively under Linux fine. :confused:
Alpinestarhero
18-07-07, 01:36 PM
Congratulations! Welcome back to the world of technology that works :D
Matt
Pedro68
23-07-07, 08:23 AM
Downloaded n tried out PCLinuxOS at the weekend ... easiest/simplest Linux I have used to date :) mind you, not done much with it yet :rolleyes:
Only been running the LiveCD version, so next step is HDD install :)
It took me less than an hour to download and burn the ISO image to CD.
Then it was just a case of dipping into the BIOS to change the boot seek order so that I could boot from CDROM, and away we go :) 5 minutes later, I'm checking my hotmail using Firefox over my wireless network.
In fact, it was sooooo easy to set up the wireless network, it is worth mentioning ...
Cancelled the setup of the wireless network connection during "install" because didn't have access to the windows installation on the same machine, then once Linux was ready to run, I simply went to config panel, installed the hardware by selecting the windows ndis wrapper driver (or something?!), and then browse to the driver for my Belkin wireless NIC, it auto-detected my wireless LAN, I entered the WPA-PSK key, and I was connected and checking my e-mail with Firefox! All this took LESS THAN 5 MINUTES! Now when has anyone EVER been able to do that with Windoze?? LMAO
Will be playing about with PCLinuxOS over the coming weeks :D
Cheers,
Pete
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