Riding in Groups

[Mogs]

Following on from Jelster's thread (http://forums.sv650.org/showthread.php?t=94999)

Since being “born again”, I’ve taken a Bikesafe course and IAM. I have become quite passionate about motorcycle rider safety. Riding safe does not have to be at the expense of enjoyment. What seems to be lacking in both courses is the riding in a group element.

I had to ask on both these courses about group riding. The answer in both cases has been “Ride for Yourself”. However true this is, I went away unsatisfied with this response as it never answered the questions I had in mind but couldn’t quite express at the time.

The type of questions I had as a group novice were

· What if I can’t keep up?
· How will I know the way?
· How do I communicate with the other riders during the ride, eg I need fuel very soon or time for a comfort break?
· Can I overtake and how?
· I’m leaving the group (bye bye signal)
· Groups on Motorways?

The group I ride with usually adopt the mirror system. If there is a large meet then the club split up into subsections of no greater than 6 riders and depart at about 5 minute intervals. This works well for us as it allows us to divide into those that wish to push the boundaries and those that want to cruise around. The club is very different to riding with the .Org as the riders all have reached a certain minimum level of ability. The org is a much wider “church”.

The death last year of Dan (Haxsaw) on an .Org ride came as a very big shock, he was a very good rider. In his situation I don’t think that riding in a group was a factor and I don’t think there was anything that he could have done to avoid it. I was not with them.

Earlier this year we had a spill on a ride that I did co-ordinate, thankfully allis ok now, but he was new to group riding. I had given the pre-ride briefing, explaining the drop-off system and riding your own ride. I believe that group riding was a major factor in his off, perhaps I had not explained things well enough. I think perhaps he had fallen into the trap of fixating on the bike in front (we all do at some time) and didn’t see the dead bird on the riding line until too late.

If there is sufficient interest (say 5) then I would like to discuss the whole of the group riding subject, perhaps start off at a quiet pub, run through a briefing, ride out and return to the pub for an open question and answer discussion. I would not like people think this is a teaching session though, more of a “learn from the experience of everyone else”.

Mark (Rictus) has sent me his notes on the subject. Anyone interested?

[Jabba]

I would like to discuss the whole of the group riding subject, perhaps start off at a quiet pub...........

The man said "pub" :D

Anyone interested?

The man said "pub" :D

Yep, if you think my presence will help :thumbsup:

[Viper]

Yep, if you think my presence will help :thumbsup:

Probably wouldnt ;)


Mogs, on a serious note, I think this is a good idea. I would like to attend and also if allowed have some input.
I am new to group riding (5-6 outings) but have questions and maybe suggestions.

[fizzwheel]

If you think I can bring anything to this, then I'm happy to help out if required

[Beenz]

I've lost count how many group rideouts I've done both within the .org and outside, so maybe I can help in the discussion.

[micky t]

id be interested, im still wobbling round corners, most ive been out with are 3 others

[hovis]

only too happy to help, out with the WRC 4-6 times a month 5-30 bikes

[squirrel_hunter]

I would be interested to get involved with this.

I remember my first group ride (an .org ride) like it was yesterday and would be more than happy to pass on any 'knowledge' I may have gained since then. The questions you raised I wondered myself, I played it by ear until I was confident in a group but the one that still makes me wonder is the communication to other riders...

[Mogs]

Mark (Rictus) notes are very good and detailed, but are perhaps a bit more in-depth than I had in mind.

I suspect that we have all read around the topic, but a lot of it is still a matter of interpretation, every group seem to do things slightly different, it's here that confusion set in. I was thinking more on the lines of an open relaxed discussion on the subject. Newbies and Old hands can pitch their questions, and hopefully we will be able to draw up a set of guidelines that we can all agree and fully understand. We could then post these as a FAQ of group riding in the SWS region perhaps with a view to having them in some form adopted for the whole of the SV650.org

Mark has produced a very good pamphlet “Motorbike Rideouts – A Basic Guide”.

I propose that as a group we use some of his headings as the agenda for discussion.

Namely:

· Pre Ride-out Bike Preparation
· Emergency Information
· The Pre Ride Briefing
· Communication
· The Marker System
· The Modified Marker System
· Last Man in Mirrors System
· Group Riding Etiquette

So everyone is welcome, it’s just a matter of date and venue, any ideas?

[thinman]

I'm a bit of a virgin in this except for groups of 3 or so. I also ride alot on a push bike in groups and we have some very particular signals that we use to try and keep safe. I'd be interested to know how you guys ride and to join in a little more now that the weather isn't quite as bad!(okay so today is a bit crap but you know what I mean)

[MeridiaNx]

I'd be happy to join in for my first South West ride (since defecting from Pennine Massive) but I'll have to wait to see what route you guys end up planning...I'm stuck a bit further South West than most.

Will do my best to come along though, any ideas as yet as to rough area? Somerset/Dorset I could make, Wales gets a bit more unlikely though.

[fizzwheel]

I'd be happy to join in for my first South West ride (since defecting from Pennine Massive) but I'll have to wait to see what route you guys end up planning...I'm stuck a bit further South West than most.

Will do my best to come along though, any ideas as yet as to rough area? Somerset/Dorset I could make, Wales gets a bit more unlikely though.

If you wanted to, you'd be more than welcome to come along to this, one of us if you're worried can cover off some basic stuff

http://forums.sv650.org/showthread.php?t=87994

Or you could just do what I did on my first group ride, which was to just ride for myself and leave space around me for myself and others and I had no problems...

[MeridiaNx]

If you wanted to, you'd be more than welcome to come along to this, one of us if you're worried can cover off some basic stuff

http://forums.sv650.org/showthread.php?t=87994

Or you could just do what I did on my first group ride, which was to just ride for myself and leave space around me for myself and others and I had no problems...

Yeah I've been keeping an eye on this rideout, been job hunting though so no idea if I'll still be here then. Will come along if I am though.

No probs with group riding, done that before, just not met you lot is all but ta for the encouragement ;)

[fizzwheel]

Ah OK, I thought you were a newbie to biking, rather than a newbie to the area.

[ninja bobw]

Perhaps as the Dorset Doddle is over a month away it could be used for the group riding idea as well. I'm sure there will be enough of us to impart knowledge or advice as necessary.Even if it means splitting into slightly smaller groups if necessary depending on numbers attending.

[Mogs]

Perhaps as the Dorset Doddle is over a month away it could be used for the group riding idea as well. I'm sure there will be enough of us to impart knowledge or advice as necessary.Even if it means splitting into slightly smaller groups if necessary depending on numbers attending.

This is probably a better idea.

I propose that all interested meet an hour earlier at Podimore (10.00 am 15/09/07), we can run thru the guide. If time allows, take a very short 20 mile ride, then back to answer any questions that arise.

Proposed route (anti-clockwise)

Podimore
Sparkford
Galhampton
by-passing Castle Cary on the A371
thru Alford to
A37 South
back to Podimore

[thinman]

This sounds perfect, lets hope the weather keeps improving! more details closer to the time?

[fizzwheel]

Mogs, just an idea, What we could do, is somebody give the breif on the stuff that needs covering then ride the first part of the rideout, We're stopping at Taylors after about 30 - 35 minutes where somebody could run a Q & A session if required ?

Means we could start the usual time and everybody gets a bit longer in bed to !!

[Mogs]

Mogs, just an idea, What we could do, is somebody give the breif on the stuff that needs covering then ride the first part of the rideout, We're stopping at Taylors after about 30 - 35 minutes where somebody could run a Q & A session if required ?

Means we could start the usual time and everybody gets a bit longer in bed to !!

Okay Fizz, I did not want to interfere with the ride out plan, now that you guys have got it finely tuned, I’ll still be there at about 10 am if anyone wants to ask me questions on the QT. No guarantee that I’ll have an answer of course, but I will find out.

[fizzwheel]

I'm easy if you wanna hold a session pre rideout thats good with me, but I dont see why if we're stopping at taylors anyway we can't find a few minutes so you can run de-brief, Taylors it a bike dealer so anybody who doesnt want to take part in the de-brief can have wander round the showroom so its no trouble.

[Mogs]

I'm easy if you wanna hold a session pre rideout thats good with me, but I dont see why if we're stopping at taylors anyway we can't find a few minutes so you can run de-brief, Taylors it a bike dealer so anybody who doesnt want to take part in the de-brief can have wander round the showroom so its no trouble.

Agreed we'll do it this way.

[fizzwheel]

:thumbsup:

[ninja bobw]

Seems that we have a plan then.I dont mind TEC'ing if need be if there are smaller groups as I'll be 2 up anyway and I won't be travelling quite as quick as on the recce (or not as the case may have been:rolleyes:).Only I might not have bike run in by then.

[tee jey]

I'm easy if you wanna hold a session pre rideout thats good with me, but I dont see why if we're stopping at taylors anyway we can't find a few minutes so you can run de-brief, Taylors it a bike dealer so anybody who doesnt want to take part in the de-brief can have wander round the showroom so its no trouble.

I think it's always a good idea for the leader to have a brief chat at the start of a ride if there are new riders in the group. Even if just to outline the proposed route, to ensure everyone is fueled up and can make the first fuel stop. (excluding Firestorms which need a tanker following them:)).