Questions on the 'Police Rider's handbook" LONG!

[RingDing]

Wotcha,

Over the last few months I've become increasing concious of the fact that I've lapsed into some bad riding habits, mainly with the speed of my filtering and allowing for any unexpected movements of cars. The arrival of my little lad has re-enforced this realisation and so I thought I'd get 'The Police Rider's Handbook to Better Motorcycling' for some pointers on what else I could do better.

I've been riding 17 years but these days only cover 7000 miles a year, mainly from my commute to work each day. I was pleasantly suprised to find that I carry out most of the techniques that are discussed, although almost certainly not enough. However, there are two topics (so far!) that I don't understand the advantage of.

1) It seems that using engine braking to slow for a corner is not advised apart from 'when necessary to avoid skidding'. I use engine braking all the time, although I realise that an IL4 isn't as blessed in this department. Is there any particular reason for the empahsis beging on braking to slow down? On an open road I find my riding flows much better when using engine braking. Is it tied up with the 'information phase' i.e. not having a brake light on to inform other users you are slowing?

2) I've also never seen any book even discuss 'block shifting' before, which is a risky practice IMO, whether you're an advanced rider or not. Why make all your gear changes in one hit, when seems to be an increased risk of misjudging the correct gear to me. Does anyone on here regularly 'block shift'? Shifting through the gears sequentially helps keep the bike balanced in my experience.

Any comments?

Ideally I'll do some advanced training at some point, as its not easy to honestly assess your own riding!

[El Saxo]

Re: Q1 - I think it does have something to do with the fact you're not lighting up the brake light to alert anyone behind you to the fact that you're slowing down. I went out with an IAM instructor a couple of months ago, albeit in a car, who picked me up on this very issue and told me if I was going to use the engine braking, i should at least 'feather' the brake pedal enough to light up the brake lights. I'd imagine the same principle applies on the bike. Given the sharp reduction in speed that engine braking gives you on a twin, It kinda makes sense IMO.

[Ceri JC]

2) I've also never seen any book even discuss 'block shifting' before, which is a risky practice IMO, whether you're an advanced rider or not. Why make all your gear changes in one hit, when seems to be an increased risk of misjudging the correct gear to me. Does anyone on here regularly 'block shift'? Shifting through the gears sequentially helps keep the bike balanced in my experience.

Any comments?


Block gear changes are fine and help swift, progressive riding in certain circumstances. The place I find myself doing them most on the SV is on fast A roads with roundabouts where you can't see onto them/straightline them. I am usually going along in 4, brake for the roundabout, change straight down to 2, then use this to do the roundabout and then it's ideal for hard acceleration down the straight as you exit the roundabout.

Obviously if you're not smooth on the clutch/misjudge your speed you can have a hiccup- I locked up the back doing this one time when it wouldn't quite go into gear, then suddenly violently lurched in.


Ideally I'll do some advanced training at some point, as its not easy to honestly assess your own riding!

I'd recommend doing an IAM course. I "taught myself" using the police riders handbook (still my favourite advanced riding manual as it happens) and when it came to doing my first IAM observed ride the observer commented that he could see I had already had advance training. I told him I hadn't- that I'd merely read the book and tried to incorporate it into my riding. Still lots of stuff you miss out/that you think you're doing, but aren't quite doing right, etc. that an observer will spot.

[Lissa]

Re: Q1 - I think it does have something to do with the fact you're not lighting up the brake light to alert anyone behind you to the fact that you're slowing down. I went out with an IAM instructor a couple of months ago, albeit in a car, who picked me up on this very issue and told me if I was going to use the engine braking, i should at least 'feather' the brake pedal enough to light up the brake lights. I'd imagine the same principle applies on the bike. Given the sharp reduction in speed that engine braking gives you on a twin, It kinda makes sense IMO.

I think that is very probably the reason. Pete always makes a point of mentioning to non twin riders we haven't ridden with before that they often won't see brake lights from us because of the engine braking.:D

[Samnooshka]

Q1: I tend to use the engine for braking unless there is traffic about or i'm with other riders. But i will dab my brake light just to show people i am slowing down.

Q2: I block change down on aproach to roundabouts and junctions. Often i am in the right gear for what i need anyway, and on the sv block changing can be a bit dodgy if you are going a little too fast for that gear. In the car however, i was taught to block change by my instructor.

[RingDing]

Hmmmm. OK point taken on the engine braking. I'll try to use better rear obs and flash brake light for other users.

I'm suprised at the number of you who block change. I wonder if sequential changing got ingrained in me as I rode for a number of years before ever having the opportunity to drive a car regularly. I'd assumed that sequential shifting was the only way that people rode bikes...what a shelftered life! :D

Maybe I'll give it a go.

Thanks for the replies.

[Jackie_Black]

Cheers for bringing this book to my attention. I've just ordered one off amazon for 8 quid because you can never know too much!

[socommk23]

i always engine brake! its fun and lets the pads last longer. people behind me should be paying attention and not be on my *%$

block shifting....done it a couple of times....no problems with it.

[Nostrils]

On my CBR I always used engine braking round a bend because I found that was the best method for me. Today though with the my new SV I had to adjust my riding as I didnt feel comfortable, reduced the speed and selected the right gear and went round on the throttle. I block change a couple of gears up and down when the situation is right but tend to have got into the habit of blipping the throttle to assist with matching engine revs / speed, had a little moment when I got into first while slowing quite quickly and had the back lock slightly.

The police handbook is a great read and on every read seems to click something new each time, well worth the money.

If any of you guys is going on a BikeSafe day, they will offer this at a special price.

[Biker Biggles]

Ive always felt that the mark of a smooth rider,or driver,is rarely having to use the brake.Easy on an SV where rolling off the throttle in good time will slow you down enough for most bends.
I also like to overtake without having to brake much if at all to get back in lane.Means you have a margin for error,and errors do happen.:rolleyes:

[chazzyb]

Ive always felt that the mark of a smooth rider,or driver,is rarely having to use the brake.Easy on an SV where rolling off the throttle in good time will slow you down enough for most bends.
I also like to overtake without having to brake much if at all to get back in lane.Means you have a margin for error,and errors do happen.:rolleyes:

No brakes should mean **smooth** progress. On the other hand, don't get it out of proportion - brakes are there to scrub speed off when needed. Agree about overtaking too - passing; pulling in and braking is bad form.:smt053

[Bluepete]

Block shifting is doen in the advanced car and advanced bike system, apparenty so that there are no overlaps between braking and gear changing, ie, you shoudn't be doing both at the same time. The scenario would be, approach a hazard, use brakes to get to the appropriate speed, then change to an appropriate gear to pass the hazard.
It's supposed to offer more control as the vehicle isn't trying to accept several changes at one, from the engine beaking effect and the brakes themselves.
So I was told!!

[MiniMatt]

I get the impression that a lot of the bike stuff is carried directly from the car stuff and doesn't exactly translate too well. Block shifting is obviously cleaner in a car than a bike, but yep, something about not having brake and gear overlap they're big on. Can't say I 100% agree with it but then they're most likely better riders than me so there's probably something to it :D

I think the not relying on engine braking bit is something to do with the mantra of gears are for going, brakes for slowing. If you use the engine for braking and then find you need to scrub off more speed (or less) your options are limited - you've then got to apply the brakes or throttle to adjust, wheras if you use the brakes then your hand is already in the right place and it's just a matter of squeezing more or less. Again, I think most riders incorporate engine braking and active braking into their corner approach to end up in the right gear at the right speed pre-corner anyway. Dunno, this one I think especially seems to have been ported right across from the car course (cars having generally less engine braking).

[SV Muppet]

You're quite right when you say that gears are for going and brakes for slowing.
I think we have to distinguish between;
(a) rolling the throttle off well in advance and gently changing down as the speed decreases and;
(b) deliberately changing down to increase the revs to a signifant level so that the engine is positively slowing the bike down like the brakes would.
Over the life of a bike bear in mind that using the gears to brake constantly adds significant unnecessary wear to the engine and transmission. It's a lot cheaper, and easier, to change brake pads than a chain or gearbox!
The transmission is there to keep the engine in it's useable range so that power can be applied at any time. If you change down when braking you should aim to match the engine revs before re-engaging the clutch so that engine braking is avoided.
The lack of a brake light is an obvious issue, hence rear observation is important, but also the fact that engine braking only works on the rear wheel.
Regarding block changing down, I can understand why some riders like to do it but my personal preference is to change down as I reduce speed, blipping the throttle. I only use block changing when something unexpected happens ahead and I have to reduce speed quickly as it allows me to concentrate totally on braking and steering.

[-Ralph-]

Q1 - Its all been said, I woud agree with the brake light thing and the wear and tear, though I have to admit to not often bothering my @rse to feather the brakes myself unless my mirrors are full of some tailgating muppet!

Q2 - Yes, I block change, but not that often. Only when on the brakes hard before a sharp corner or junction usually 'cos I was going too quick anyway, or approaching a changing traffic light. I don't see that you have much choice, changing one at a time just isn't quick enough.

Thanks for reminding me that my copy of the book is on (now very long term) loan to my cousin! :rolleyes: