Race tyres for road use?

[JPT650]

Hi guys and gals
i am currently rebuilding my sv650 and have been thinking about the issue of what tyres i should put onto the bike. I was going to go with Pirelli supercorsa's as even tho race tyres will not last as long as normal tyres they will give the bike a whole lot more stick on the road. What i'm wondering is if there are any other options in the tyre market that are just as good as the pirelli supercorsa's?

[John 675]

Wow that was an eye opener... lol,
(massive font)

Anyhow if you check in the hardware section, there is a sub heading for what people recommend, all sorts in there
i use Z6's but they are more of a sport / touring tyre. :D

[John 675]

oh yeah and welcome BTW :D

[JPT650]

Ok thanks man! yeh the font is massive i didnt realise it would be that big, but thanks for your help,

[John 675]

No problem dude :)

[Sideshow#36]

Yeah supercorsas are superb bits of kit, but I wouldnt reccomend them for the road at all. Not unless you are prepared to stick some tyre warmers on before the ride and you dont stop moving on your ride, ie running reds levelcrossings and roundabouts. They are awful when cold but when warm thay are awesome. On the road bike I use Michelin Pilot Powers, great bit of kit.

[fizzwheel]

As said they'll only work if you can keep them hot, which at this time of year especially in the rain is probably unlikely.

Why not go for some road orientated. Pirelli Diablo Corsa III, Michellin Pilot Power 2CT, or Dunlop Quailfiers...

They'll all last longer than the Supercorsa, and they'll cope better with start stop road riding and cold days or if you get caught out in the rain.

[JPT650]

Yeh was thinking that my friend runs the supercorsa's on his gsxr750 srad and he says that the grip he gets from them are better then any road tyre. in the research i have been doing tho i'm thinking its got to be between the pilot's and the Z6's they have good grip when cold and warm up pretty fast. I've just converted the front end of my sv to gsxr i've got a rear z6 for the sv so just got to buy a trye for the gsxr front wheel

[northwind]

Helpfully, I've got a new and a part used Z6 120/70 in the shed, if you want one ;) PM me if so, I've got a set of Diablo Stradas to wear out and I think I'll be going to 021s next (nothing wrong with the Z6s, the Stradas are practically the same tyre, but I got a set of low-mileage takeoffs for £50 ;) )

Supercorsas have tons of grip, but in all honesty most people don't need it, so you end up trading tyre life that you can use for traction that you don't need. I've got old SPortec M-1s on at the moment (which again, were dirt cheap), which are a bit outdated but still more than grippy enough for my purposes- I'm sworn off trackdays just now and I personally don't want to ride on the road in a manner that needs stickier tyres ;)

TBH I think most people who use the really sticky tyres on the road are wasting their money. Not saying your mate is, he might not, but the combination of sticky rubber, massive chicken strips, and no signs of heat distress seem to be a classic one wherever sportsbike gather!

These days, sport touring tyres are frankly incredible, Niall Mackenzie mentioned in a review that the 021s are stickier than most race tyres were when he went pro!

[northwind]

PS, pics of bike please :)

[JPT650]

Yeh i hear what you saying. I been converstating with a few of my family and friends that ride and they been telling me the same thing that you are. thanks for looking out tho. i'm just waiting for my frame and swing arm to come back from powdercoaters once it does i will give you a shout with regards your tyre that you got lying around. love the look of your bike by the way. i was torn between going for the race look with mine or the naked streetfighter look and i decided to go for the streetfighter look. once i get the frame back from powdercoaters and do the rebuild i will post some pics

[northwind]

Cool, mine will go the same way at some point I reckon. But it's just about winter so I'm keeping my fairing for now :D

[Hazzar]

Helpfully, I've got a new and a part used Z6 120/70 in the shed, if you want one ;) PM me if so, I've got a set of Diablo Stradas to wear out and I think I'll be going to 021s next (nothing wrong with the Z6s, the Stradas are practically the same tyre, but I got a set of low-mileage takeoffs for £50 ;) )

Supercorsas have tons of grip, but in all honesty most people don't need it, so you end up trading tyre life that you can use for traction that you don't need. I've got old SPortec M-1s on at the moment (which again, were dirt cheap), which are a bit outdated but still more than grippy enough for my purposes- I'm sworn off trackdays just now and I personally don't want to ride on the road in a manner that needs stickier tyres ;)

TBH I think most people who use the really sticky tyres on the road are wasting their money. Not saying your mate is, he might not, but the combination of sticky rubber, massive chicken strips, and no signs of heat distress seem to be a classic one wherever sportsbike gather!

These days, sport touring tyres are frankly incredible, Niall Mackenzie mentioned in a review that the 021s are stickier than most race tyres were when he went pro!
Who makes 021s i have bridgestone 020s at the min but there isnt much life left in them

[northwind]

Bridgestone... They're the replacements for the 020.

[Blue_SV650S]

I use USED race Supercorsa’s on my road bike (as partworns are cheap:)), bearing in mind they need to be HOT to work at their best, they actually work surprisingly well in the wet and in the cold!! 8)

Bear in mind that race compound tyres suffer from something called ‘heat cycling’ … i.e. every time you get them hot then let them cool, they are harder the next time to get the grip (you are actually raising the initial ‘work’ temperature).

Although happy to use partworns due to cost/recycling, I’d not buy NEW track compound tyres for the road.

Oh and you can get road compound and race compound (the ones that are SC rated … e.g. SC1, SC2).

[monkey]

Sorry to butt in but my Daytona has Pirelli Dragon SuperCorsa Pro tyres on it and I don't know what they're supposed to be like? I'm not a mentalist by any means on the road but want to get as many track days out of them as possible. I think I know the answer here but should I get another set of wheels with road tyres or swap the tyres with decent road based ones after a track day?

[Berlin]

Supercorsa Pro's are incredible. They've got more grip than you'll ever need for the road. But then you'll never need that much grip on the road so it's a bit of a waste.

The harder you ride, the grippier they get, but then that can lead to problems too. Try riding through the gravel at a junction and they pick up that gravel and spray the bike. I found they also pick up autumn leaves too it the roads dry.

If you are looking for most miles on trackdays go for something like Conti Roadattacks or Michelin Pilot Road CT2's They are at the "sensible" end of the scale. They'll still allow you to ground out the pegs though so have more than enough grip. Some use them as intermediates when racing too. The warm up quickly and stay warm longer. They are designed to be effective at a much lower temperature than the Super Sticky stuff. They'll work from ambient up to about 50 degrees. (no problem going higher)

A step up from that woulkd be the Sportier model of each, being the Conti Sportattack and Michelin Pilot Sport CT2's. Both are slightly softer than the above and so wear faster but grip more. These will have a temperature range of 35-60 degrees. They also allow for over 50 degrees of lean (a LOT!)

At the top end you have the super sticky stuff that you only really need for racing. (and don't think you'll be anywhere near racing pace on a track day :) ) These would be the Pirelli SCorsa pro's, Conti Race attacks, and a whole host of other "race tyres for the road". Everyone has one in their range. Some have several. These run at 65-85 degrees as a rough guide and cool quickly. Not good for commuting or in the rain so much. Not dangerous, just not grippy.

Are they worth the trade off? Well, not for 7 months of the year. Keeping them super sticky is difficult due to the cool temperatures. They still wear quite quickly despite not being grippy so it's not a good trade. I ride about 100 miles at a time and I can physically see the difference after every ride with the SC Pro's.

Far better to have something like the Roadattack that is sticky all year round just not as sticky as the SC Pro's in the summer.

In the rain, the Roadattack or the Michelin pilot road CT2 will run rings round the SC pro simply from being warmer. Its operating in it's temerature range when the SC pro is about 60 degrees too cool.

Saying that, everyone should try some SC Pro's in the summer. They really are breathtaking! You can be ridiculously heavy handed even as far as you can possibly lean and the tyres will just stick. Whip the throttle open on a bumpy B road (on the SV 650) at 45 degrees of lean and nothing but forward motion occurs (tried it!). you just can't upset them! :) They also give you lots of warning if they are not up to temperature before letting go completely. They tell you when they are ready.

I suppose it comes down to ability. If you can find the limits of lower group, move up to the next group up. If you find the limits of those, then move up again. If you never reach the limits, then you never need to move up.

[monkey]

Cheers Berlin! Talk about comprehensive. I'm not a super fast rider at all so I reckon once these go I'll get some middle of the road sporty tyres. How many track days should I expect from the Dragons after say 1000 or so road miles and don't they heatcycle out so even if there's loads of rubber left they go bad?

:)

[Berlin]

I get mine as race scrubs so I don't know how many you'd get. Mine have already had a good old melting on both sides when I get them.

The ones I'm running now had 8 laps and the warm ups on them and I've done about 1200 miles on the on the road (all hard riding, no pootling or commuting) The rear is going to be gone by 2000 maybe 2500 at the latest. but it'll wear out on the sides first! No flattening off on these puppies! :)

The front still looks good for at least another rear (I'm running SC1 on the front and SC2 on the rear)

But it doesn't really matter because they are £50 a pair :) Buy them, stick them on, ride the bumpkins off them and stick another set on :)

If I was buying them new... I wouldn't :) I'd buy Michelin Pilot roads 2ct's or Road attacks. In fact I might fit some Road attacks when this rear is done and save the SC Pro's for next year once the salt is gone.

Due to them being used so quickly, heat cycling isn't an issue. If I was only using them to do 500 miles a year then they may be affected but They get a good thrashing twice a week at 100 miles each time.

One the road I can't get them up to full race temperature no matter how hard I ride so it's even less of an issue. (and boy have I tried!)

One thing I do notice is, with SC Pro's is that you have to be the boss. For gentle riding it's like dealing with a teenager. They'll grumble and complain. Niggling you. You have to say "OI! I'm in charge here"! and put them in their place. As soon as you up the pace, they come alive. They go from twitchy and playing up to absolutely superb. If I were a beginner or nervous rider, I'd think they were the worst tyre in the world. I'd be constantly fighting them because they would be boss. Push back and they sing like angels.The harder you push, the better the song. Having the nerve to push a tyre that isn't giving you confidence can be difficult for a beginner but as soon as you do you see the rewards.

[Dicky Ticker]

As a bye note if anybody wants to try some race tyres I have some used Metz RensportRS2's 2 Rear and 1 front all with still 4m tread in the centres but def no chicken strips=£60 Plus set of full wets used but loads of life[Mich rear Perrelli front] for £50------------Just in case somebody wants to experiment

[Blue_SV650S]

As a bye note if anybody wants to try some race tyres I have some used Metz RensportRS2's 2 Rear and 1 front all with still 4m tread in the centres but def no chicken strips=£60 Plus set of full wets used but loads of life[Mich rear Perrelli front] for £50------------Just in case somebody wants to experiment

Oh and for thems not in the know the Rennsports are identical to the SCs (apart from a subtly different tread pattern) ... they are made in the same factory the lot supposedly ... so if you are looking for SCs you are also looking for Rennsports ;)

HTH :)

I'll just add I think Road Attacks are hideous, the profiles are well 'flat' ... bet they would be a pig on track!!!

The best idea is to not compromise, a set of wheels with track SCs on and some road tyres for the road ...

Its fine to use x-track tyres on the road, but I wouldn't want to use track tyres on the road and then take them back to the track ... its not like they wont work at all, but you will have changed the profile and put a few more heat cycles on them ... :thumbdown:

[monkey]

Sorry to keep interupting your thread JPT, but do you lot think it'd be wise for me to get some sport touring tyres or slightly sporty tyres for road use and swap to the supercorsas for track days only? I've been reading responses to my thread on swapping tyres myself and would be happy doing that before trackdays. I'll probably be doing a max of about 8 or 10 next year. I don't ride like a loony and am a bit worried that the Pirellis will cause an off, plus it seems silly to use up good sticky rubber on the road where I won't make the most of it. Oh yeah, if the answer is yes, what tyres do you reckon for the road on a Daytona 675?

Thanks.
:)

[Berlin]

If you got Conti Sport Attacks, Diablo Corsa III's or Pilot Power 2 CT's you'd not need to change for the track. :)

[Ter]

Not saying your mate is, he might not...

Well the GSXR is parked up now...;)
I know what you mean about the sportsbike gatherings though!!

I don't have any strips left (well on the rear at least - 180 rather than 190...)
There is a sign of the heat cycle from my last track day - this'll change soon though with a bit if use.

I've always run SC's on my bikes - I'll buy track used ones, cheap for what they give you!!

For the way I ride, I want as much grip as possible! The moment that did if for me was when I went out for a stunt ride session in the wet!! Managed to endo the SRAD while it was raining 8)
I do tend to lean in the wet but I'll just hang off a bit more than if it were dry!

Don't worry too much about the tyres for now JPT650, when I finish the build we'll go slow until your peg scraping!! :smt045