How To Rate A Tyre In The Wet

[Steve_God]

Hi all,
I've read many times about tyres being 'great in the wet' and all... but how exactly do you that have made statements like that, come to your conclusions? (Without binning several bikes in the process)

* With my OE Dunlops, I never rode them hard enough in the wet to know where the limit was, being relatively new to biking.

* My next tyres were the Bridgestone 020s, now these I felt were generally better at the time, but looking back, they never felt 'planted' in the wet or dry, and always felt like they would slide out at any moment, but never actually did!

* My next (and current) tyres are Pirelli Diablos. With these they feel so much more 'stuck' to the road that I love them to bits in the dry, however once it comes to wet riding, I hear that they're not so good, so because of that, I don't ride them anything like I do in the dry, but have found it's limit the other night while doing a tad over 80 (KM/H officer ;)) round a moderate bend, and caught a small patch of lying water and the back wheel flicked out a little, enough to let me know that I'd found the limit in the wet.

My dilemma is that I can't remember if I would have had the same twitch from the back tyre with the 020s (or indeed with any other 'better in the wet' tyre) going through a small patch of lying water or not, as it never felt grippy enough to risk going as fast in the first place.

So how do you all work out whether a tyre is better in the wet over others?

[plowsie]

Do the same sorta run on different tyres, ie. your run to work. I tended to find my 020s gave way a bit but gave me some notice, my Qualifiers just give way in dry when they are cold now , not too great for me in the rain but i think that is cos i have run the tread right out lol. Nowt left on em now.

When we say a tyre is good in the rain it usually means how well it will allow you to ride towards your dry riding in a sense. Grip, lean angles, notice before tyre lets go and how quickly the tyre warms up before you can put it through a corner at a good speed.

I remember starting a thread about wet riding, does anybody change their style, some say yes, some say no, this could be down to ability(not sayin anyone is a bad rider)/confidence, tyres and how bad the conditions are.

Personally i am crap in the wet and could prob ice skate more comfotably than my riding.

[DanAbnormal]

Don't forget the road surface can also contribute. My BT014's are awesome in teh UK but when I went to Germany teh back end was sliding out on every bend due to the difference in road surface/lack of drainage.

[plowsie]

IMO thats not tyres, more sorta road surfaces, i find any set of tyres i have had cant deal with one or two roads surfaces i know, or maybe your right and i just dont have the confidence to tackle them to test.

[DanAbnormal]

My wet weather riding comes and goes. Sometimes I can be brave as you like and have been as brave/stupid enough to get kneedown in the wet (on the Nurburgring mind) other times I ride bolt upright and very cautiously. Most of the time I give myself much more of an error for margin in the wet plus as soon as I see drops of diesel I go very steady, most of the time on my commute as it's a bus route.

The standard Dunlops D220's on the SV were okay but not great in the wet. I ofund they lacked feedback and just felt (to me) as if I was not sure how much grip I had, or indeed didn't have. When I changed to BT014s they were much more responsive and even the softer 010's on my Ninja seem to cope with wet weather very well (in this country at least).

[G]

Although I'm totally happy to ride in the rain I'm 110% more concious and just take my time.

You can have the best wet tyres in the world and be cornering at a reasonable rate of progress, but if the level of standing water running across the road changes whilst your giving it some lean you cant adapt to that, you go down. Soaking wet roads with standing water and to some extent just wet roads hide a magnitude of sins from oil, diesel, white lines and road surface changes.......More than happy to ride in it but would never attempt to test the wet limits of a tyre, its asking for trouble.

[plowsie]

Asked too much of one of mine back in March, that wasnt fun. Was just been silly and optimistic at the time, trying to test them too much. Live and learn.........

[northwind]

I just do it by repetition- there's a roundabout at the end of my road that I've gone round about 2000 times in all weathers so even I can figure out where the limits are on that one :D and then I just compare results. I've got a few spots I do this at for all sorts of mods, my wee test track.

[RhythmJunkie]

Good surface and wet is good and your own confidence will probably be the limiting factor with todays tyre compounds. Add some diesel and a few bad repairs and no tyres will grip properly. So its swings and roundabouts time....too many variables to make an accurate judgment. You really do have to ride on the same surface in the same weather conditions/temperatures to have a good idea of the differences.

I take note from tyre testing by the magazines. They do push tyres to the max so give a good indication of limits that we will mostly never achieve! Let someone else do the testing for you! :)

[Ashy]

Did I join a racers forum?

Is it just me or does it seem totally insane to push your bike like you're riding in the dry when it's raining? The only two groups of people who need amazing grip at high speed in the wet are racers and police riders. I may not own an SV yet, but when I do I won't be trying to be the next Rossi down the A446 in the middle of November.


Good grip is important, but pushing yourself "to the limit" in the wet, or on public roads, makes you no more of a sensible road user than the BMW / Volvo driver not checking his mirrors, or the white van changing lanes as he wishes without looking or indicating.

Maybe I should get a moped instead... :D

EDIT: If your tyres can't cope with the road surface or conditions, it's not their fault. THEY'RE NOT CONTROLLING THE THROTTLE.

[plowsie]

Did I join a racers forum?

Is it just me or does it seem totally insane to push your bike like you're riding in the dry when it's raining? The only two groups of people who need amazing grip at high speed in the wet are racers and police riders. I may not own an SV yet, but when I do I won't be trying to be the next Rossi down the A446 in the middle of November.


Good grip is important, but pushing yourself "to the limit" in the wet, or on public roads, makes you no more of a sensible road user than the BMW / Volvo driver not checking his mirrors, or the white van changing lanes as he wishes without looking or indicating.

Maybe I should get a moped instead... :D

EDIT: If your tyres can't cope with the road surface or conditions, it's not their fault. THEY'RE NOT CONTROLLING THE THROTTLE.
In your opinion....

In mine i would like to be able to determine if i need to use the tyres for any such reason at a progressive speed....

Never know when you might need to pick the pace up at a point for whatever reson IMO

[northwind]

And also, finding the limits doesn't mean finding how far you can lean, it also means finding how hard you can brake, which is a pretty handy thing to know... A lot of accidents are caused by overbraking, but I think just as many occur that could have been avoided had the rider not underbraked... Knowing how hard you can push your tyres could make that difference.

[plowsie]

And also, finding the limits doesn't mean finding how far you can lean, it also means finding how hard you can brake, which is a pretty handy thing to know... A lot of accidents are caused by overbraking, but I think just as many occur that could have been avoided had the rider not underbraked... Knowing how hard you can push your tyres could make that difference.
+1 on that :notworthy:

[Steve_God]

EDIT: If your tyres can't cope with the road surface or conditions, it's not their fault. THEY'RE NOT CONTROLLING THE THROTTLE.
In your opinion....
In mine i would like to be able to determine if i need to use the tyres for any such reason at a progressive speed....
Never know when you might need to pick the pace up at a point for whatever reson IMO
+1!!!

You never know if a rabbit is going to run out in front of you on a straight road while in the wet, and it makes knowing the limits of your tyres in the wet a VERY good thing knowing whether you can swerve to avoid it without coming off in those split seconds you have.

I'd rather know that in advance than find out one day and end up sliding down the the road at 60mph on my ****, with a few hundred £'s of repairs afterwards!

[Alpinestarhero]

In your opinion....

In mine i would like to be able to determine if i need to use the tyres for any such reason at a progressive speed....

Never know when you might need to pick the pace up at a point for whatever reson IMO

Agrreed. It is good to know just what you can do - emergency stops in the rain are scary, but if you have played and know your tyres can grip, then you have a bit more confidence if you need to emergency stop. Likewise, if you need to make a sudden turn, knowing that your tyres grip to X angle means you dont tense up, allowing you to make the emergency manouver and stay sunny side up.

There is nothing wrong with riding fast in the rain, so long as you build yourself up and learn to understand the feedback from the bike. Ashy, I can see what you mean and how you think we are all a bit egotistic with tales of riding fast in the wet, but many of the riders on here take time to learn about their motorcycle. Not many of us aspire to being racers, but we do aspire to having excellent control of our machines!

on topic now, my MEZ6's are great wet or dry. I can feel them moving about a bit, not enough to get scared but enough for me to know whats going on. They didnt even let go when i accidently ran over a wet manhole cover on a wet road a few months back - a little slide, then recovered. Bloomin' fantastic. Wet riding is all about confidence, understanding and being relaxed.

Bit like dry riding, really

Matt

[Ashy]

Apologies, all. I did sound a little disparaging without understanding the full meaning of what was said.

Suffice to say my :rant: is safely tucked away in the cupboard now! :-ddHumility learned :D

[Alpinestarhero]

Apologies, all. I did sound a little disparaging without understanding the full meaning of what was said.

Suffice to say my :rant: is safely tucked away in the cupboard now! :-ddHumility learned :D

We've all been there, so dont worry :D now go out in the wet, and ride like a loon :bom:

Matt

[plowsie]

Lol i think that is taking it a bit far Matt :-P

Ashy if you are thinking of going a bit quicker, testing yourself in wet, do it in stages. I am not saying go from riding very slowly to trying to ride as quick as ya do in dry, build yourself up, your tyres will give some notice before they are gonna give way, but if you take the Michael Jackson then they aren't gonna be nice. I have been riding very slowly in the rain, mainly due to a section of 2 inches across my back tyre is less than 1mm.

Stu

[Ashy]

I currently ride a Chinese 125 cruiser with tyres like molded plastic.

Going fast at all is impossible for me :D


Still, it's fun to dream, and my dreams include a black SV :cool:

[plowsie]

aha the fastest colour, you should have no probs in the wet then mate ;)

[northwind]

You never know if a rabbit is going to run out in front of you on a straight road while in the wet, and it makes knowing the limits of your tyres in the wet a VERY good thing knowing whether you can swerve to avoid it without coming off in those split seconds you have.


Just squish it :)

[plowsie]

Just squish it :)
I saw a hedhog in front of me last night i had the choice, i avoided him :smt012

[RhythmJunkie]

I saw a hedhog in front of me last night i had the choice, i avoided him

Epithet to roadkill:

"Survival of the fastest!" :)

[Steve_God]

Just squish it :)
Known of people coming off after hitting rabbits at speed though :smt104

[SVeeedy Gonzales]

It's subjective - go round a corner cranked over in the wet and hit a manhole cover and they'll all slide. I never had the OE Dunlops slide on anything other than white lines and manhole covers in the wet but I did get them both locked and the whole bike sliding once in the dry, upright when braking hard on the Dunlops.
Got Pirelli Diablo Stradas now and they're fine - they'll let go on mud and manhole covers in the wet yet they're reliable elsewhere in the wet even under hard braking.

Consistency is an important thing too - it's ok (I think) if they always skid on the same road features in the wet e.g. white lines as you can then avoid them. The Dunlops were scary because they would grip fine at times and not at others that were similar conditions. If you know the tyres will let go on the manhole cover, when they do let go it's expected and something you just ride over, literally.

[northwind]

Known of people coming off after hitting rabbits at speed though :smt104

Really? Fair enough then, I've hit a couple and it's just a wee thwack but maybe I've just been lucky. I'd probably still rather take my chances with the bunny than with evasion on a wet surface though. (though having said that, I once got a dead rabbit caught in the rear downpipe of my Virago, and didn't notice til I got to work and found a delicious combination of barbeque smell and burnt hair and bones wafting up from underneath me :sick: