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Always a good one for tense arms is can you flap your elbows like a bird... You should be able to move your elbows up and down and not affect the steering for the bike.

Quote:

Originally Posted by carelesschucca (Post 3063552)

Always a good one for tense arms is can you flap your elbows like a bird... You should be able to move your elbows up and down and not affect the steering for the bike.

We do this to avoid car mirrors in London :cool:

Quote:

Originally Posted by carelesschucca (Post 3063552)

Always a good one for tense arms is can you flap your elbows like a bird... You should be able to move your elbows up and down and not affect the steering for the bike.

Same with golf, many people hold the club way too tightly - should be held with fingers mainly and not gripped as though your life depends on it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by carelesschucca (Post 3063552)

Always a good one for tense arms is can you flap your elbows like a bird... You should be able to move your elbows up and down and not affect the steering for the bike.

I read similar advice to this in one of the mags very soon after I started riding when I were a lad - keep your elbows loose, and make sure you bend the elbow in the direction you're turning (i.e. when turning left, keep your left elbow bent softly).

Made a big difference to my cornering confidence.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talking Heads (Post 3063440)

Hmm, "and some people never do it", these will be the people who only ride in straight lines?

To go round corners you absolutely have to make the correct steering inputs, whether consciously or unconsciously.

People simply don't need to know about so called "counter steering", if they are able to ride round corners they will already be doing it.

Steering a bike, and the influence your weight can have on how the machine reacts to your inputs and handles the various other forces acting on it is a massive subject and worthy of much debate, however......

Counter steering IS something we all do instinctively, but understanding what you are doing and the effects it has on the bike are very useful when it comes to developing your riding beyond the simple A to B stuff. Many don't need, or want, to do this and that's fine, but to say people don't need to know what they are doing is setting yourself, and others, pretty low standards.

It is also true that simply moving your weight from one side to the other will have little influence on the course the bike takes, at least not initially, however the position of the COG and it's ability to be moved around, both in order to improve grip (hanging off), and to reduce the effect of a sudden input (getting above the bike or "counter leaning" as some like to call it) will most certainly make a difference to how the machine reacts to an input from the tyres/suspension. Remember you represent between 30 and 50% of the total all up weight so that's quite a bit of useful inertia you have in your hands... quite literally!

Quote:

Originally Posted by R1ffR4ff (Post 3063548)

Great post :)

Just to add.Never cross the centre line and watch out for idiots coming wide on the bends from the other direction.

Ref idiots in middle of road, two motorcycles have nearly got me like this!

The Twist of the wrist video s give a good insight on the way counter stear etc all go to make life easier for man and machine.
It's important to remember that the bike and you will go where your looking.
Looking at the hedge,car or bit fallen off the truck in front of you will pull you in like a Tractor Beam...

Counter-steering really only refers to the initiation of a turn, when you want the bike to change direction quickly, when you push on the handlebar centrifugal force causes the bike to 'flop over' on to the same side as you pushed (because CofG is vertically above contact patch when bike is going straight - but if you keep pushing the bike will go further and further over), after that its all about the geometry of the bike and where your weight + bike weight is in relation to the contact patch of tyres. Arguably the only time you need to counter-steer once bike is in a turn is to tighten your line, otherwise just hold the bars lightly and physics and the frame designers skills do their job and get you where you want to go.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DomP (Post 3063486)

As a novice I know for a fact I've been going around sweeping bends and suffered from watching the hedge getting nearer and nearer and had to counterterrorism myself out of fixating on the hedge. Can't remember the term for it, something like object fixation?

You need some training before the inevitable happens. Try and find a copy of Twist of the wrist I or I I to watch.

Hey guys read the bit where I said this was when I was pootling about on a CBT!