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Thoughts on the GS ?
Bit of an odd one. Anyone got any thoughts on the BMW 1200 GS?
Be interested to hear from people who have experienced riding them and people who haven't. Anyone considered owning one or had one and got rid of it? |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Biggest concern I'd have is with potential very expensive faults. There have been a number of big issues with various years/models. You'll find plenty of folk who have done a gazillion miles on one with absolutely no issues, on the other hand you'll also find horror stories.
A good friend had a R1200RT, not exactly the same animal I know, but there were several significant issues before he p/ex'd it for a Tiger. If you go in with your eyes open then fine. Plenty about to choose from. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Are you looking for another bike already Adam?
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Older ones are quite affordable to buy too as the market is so flooded with them, but affording to buy one and affording to run and keep one are two different things with BMWs it seems. Makes me wonder why so many people sell them though. They're really easy going to ride and comfortable but maybe that translates into boring after not too long on them. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
I wonder if it's the difference in BMW's perceived reliability and actual reliability. Years ago German engineering was excellent but then they seemed to embrace complexity in all their products and reliability suffered but their reputation lives on.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=r1...+drive+failure https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=r1200gs+head+shake https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=r1200gs+abs+failure I wondered if the servicing was expensive (so people sold before they were due) but it doesn't seem that bad although valve checks were every 6000 miles. You see a lot of Street Triples sold before 12k for that reason (12k service was about £650 on the 675). |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Heard a few horror tales of final drive failures etc which lead into £thousands, never really been a common cause. A fella I know had a load of bother with his 1200 yet he's meticulous in servicing and maintenance, so it's not necessarily down to poor upkeep, perhaps poor design. It got chopped in for a V-Strom which has been faultless.
I loved the GS when I rode one, easily the most comfortable and surprising bike I've ever thrown a leg over. It has no business being a jack of all trades but somehow just thunders along no bother, 2up loaded touring or playing at off-road trail places. I would consider buying one at my ripe old age of 31, if I had the space to keep it. Tracer is already ropey on the shed floor |
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Just like the German tanks introduced later in WW2, the armies chief gripe was 'they use too much fuel and break down too often' basically they were too complex for the battlefield and spent a lot of their time broken down awaiting spares that never arrived. Plus it is a brave man who would take a 600lb bike off-road. I was talking to a rider at a bike show, he said its a good road bike but I am never going off-road with it again. if you want to go off-road the 800 probably better, but Rotax not BMW engine. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
I rode my friends 1200 adventure. It felt like a chopper after the VFR. I've long legs but I struggled with the height of it. Overall I can't see what all the fuss is about.
I'm not a fan of adventure bikes in general though. Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Supervox has/had one, don't know how much he uses the forum these days though, so send him a PM and he may well get an email notification....
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Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
ok i'm a bit one eyed at the moment (****ed as afatrt) but i would suggest that you try one.. no point in bashing them on single track and more suited to MW crusing. if you want a off road laner then go for something lighter in weight as your only doing 20-30mph. if you want an all round tourer then go for a VFR...
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I have a VFR. It's a beaten up old thing and I love it. :p |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Wow, on searching there's some real horror stories around. Mostly to do with the newer ones strangely. They do offer good warrantiies (3 years on used ones) from main dealers but maybe there's a reason for that?
Also found this...
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Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Cheers Chris. I'm definitely getting older as that was a very enjoyable Sunday morning watch! That guy is just up the road from me too coincidentally.
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Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Maybe I am too, I love mechanical stuff. Better than netflix
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Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
That was all pleasantly mechanical too. The newer all digital dash with electric auto adjustment everything GSA I test rode felt like it was all circuits and wires and so far removed from anything mechanical feeling.
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Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
My brother has a GSA new/recent models, and my old man had a GS a few years ago.
Both of them enjoy them as the bike is very capable at essentially everything. You could say its the bike equivalent of an SUV! Yes there are faster bikes, or more mainstream, but they are good bikes (and must be looked after). Yes they have faults, but what bike doesn't? If you check on Auto trader, most the main bikes with high mileages will be GS/GSA simply because they are built to last and are relatively easy to maintain. Add to that the ability to customise and buy every conceivable accessory to make it yours and do everything you want, it's a good package. I am eyeing one up as my next bike./travel machine to do long tours on. As I am not of a large stature I will probably opt for the GS as the GSA will simply be too large/heavy for me. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
I have a 2015 GS Adventure, had it for 2 years. Had grand plans for 2-3 week tours but unfortunately life has gotten in the way since then and the only long trip I have done is 5 days in Scotland. I have done about 6 weekend trips though.
In that time the only thing that went wrong was a complete gearbox failure. Only cost about 2k to fix. Fortunately I took out an extended warranty from BMW and they covered it minus the excess of £50. Had the bike in for a week and gave me a loaner the whole time. As for the bike itself, as a piece of engineering, there is nothing I have ridden that can match it. The suspension is sublime and even 2 up with luggage, you aren't bothered by anything. It does however sometimes feel a bit slow to respond and you can feel a little disconnected. It's nothing to worry about though, the bike will give most sports bikes a run for their money on the handling side. Power wise, it's got enough, doesn't set the world on fire like a big 4 pot litre bike but has enough for UK roads. On the motorway it does struggle a little at high speed, the aerodynamics are akin to a brick and the front can feel a little light over 90mph. Overall it's a great bike, horrendously expensive to run, (£350 for a service and £400 for a warranty every year. Insurance is also high.) Way more fun than it looks and as a tool for getting somewhere in comfort it's probably the best out there. I will probably be getting rid of it soon though. I don't do the miles to make it worth the cost these days and I also have a GSR750 which is just as much fun on a sunny day. https://i.imgur.com/1BUhaGd.jpg |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
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eeek!! the "only" thing! That seems quite major. Is it a common issue on them? Cheers for the (otherwise positive) write up. + I definitely felt more disconnected on the bigger Adventure than I did on the standard. The Adventure was a newer more electronic version though so I mostly put it down to that. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
I haven't heard of other with the same issue so I was probably just unlucky.
Had a corroded rear brake caliper as well which was sticking, goes through rear pads pretty quickly too as the traction control and ABS systems use them. Oh, the satnav mount broke too so I can't take the satnav out of the cradle. The rear shock has started to corrode, in fact there are signs of corrosion in a lot of places. Other than that it has been fine.:smt104 |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Complete gearbox failure
£400 a year for 'warranty' Slow responding throttle and feels disconnected Struggles at high speed Bad aerodynamics Front end goes light over 90mph £350 services High insurance Corroding calipers, shock and bike in general Ooooh yeah, sign me up for one of those! :smt044 |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
To add some context/real life in to this:
Complete gearbox failure - bad luck that can happen on any vehicle £400 a year for 'warranty' - on a bike worth £10k, it's not really a lot when you consider that a 2K repair means you've had/got 5 years cover free! Slow responding throttle and feels disconnected - it's not a lightweight sports bike. A 250kg (+ passengers) weight bike is probably worse off with a light snappy throttle Struggles at high speed - aerodynamics of a brick . . . Bad aerodynamics - see above Front end goes light over 90mph - unless you're in Germany it shouldn't be a problem £350 services - BMW labour rate is £120 per hour . . . . High insurance - much sorted after bike and worth a lot of cash. like any super bike Corroding calipers, shock and bike in general - like most Japanese bikes do . . . Nothing out the ordinary really. It's an 'adventure' bike, yes it can go off road if you want but it's more the adventure of packing it with luggage and riding off to wherever. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
There's plenty of history of "reliable" japanese bikes having major failure issues. Classics like the FZ1 generator magnets coming loose and destroying a few engines. Not even a Yamaha recall on that... owners just had to know to get it changed out themselves before the inevitable happened.
I found the throttle just needed winding on a bit further to get the same feel as an immediate sport bike would have. As you say, that can be a good thing. Plenty of people buy sports bikes and do throttle mods too (SV with R1 throttle? Street Triple with the Speed throttle?) as they can have slower feel than wanted too. I found the aerodynamics pretty good for the type of bike it is. Better than the problems I had with the Tracer which became a big part of why I got rid of it. So I was very aware of focusing on the air flow smoothness, affect of the screen positions etc to make sure it didn't have similar problems. I don't think it's the sort of bike I'd ride much over 90mph. I did get a trial insurance quote for a fictional 2013 GS and it was lower than other bikes I've been quoted for. It was less for a whole year than just the additional cost I paid putting my GSXR on my insurance instead of the Street Triple for the few months remaining on my policy. Got a feeling the GSXR is going to be a shock when I try to get a whole year! Even my impressivley corrosion resitant Honda has areas that haven't avoided some corrosion and flaking. Overall I think if I had the money to spare for the upkeep of one (or better still if it was a paid business cost) and I was putting lots of commuting miles on one for a well paid job then I think I'd have one. It's a very easy ride. Very different to any other bike I've tried. As it is I'll keep coating my VFR800 in ACF50 and only taking pictures of it from a distance to avoid showing it's battle scars. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Some confusion it seems: the throttle isn't slow to respond, in fact the fueling is pretty much perfect.
I was talking about the rear suspension, as it's a little on the soft side, it feels like it's wallowing a little on a bumpy road. It's not though, it's just doing it's job really well, but after years of riding sports bikes or bikes with basic suspension it feels strange at first. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
One thing I really liked was the electronic suspension modes. Being able to change from standard to "dynamic" on the fly and firm things up is amazing. You can have super plush (maybe slightly bouncy) suspension for normal (*terrible UK*) roads and then when you hit a decent patch or want to press on put it in dynamic and it feels solid. Same for the throttle. I think the "slow" feeling on the throttle I experienced was the regular mode compared to the immediate grab of the GSXR / Street Triple that I've got used to recently. The dealer wouldn't let me put it in dynamic to ride away and insisted I needed to get used to it as "dynamic throttle mode is aggressive". I switched it pretty quickly once I'd set off and found it much better. So, you get a choice of reponse and suspension feel at the press of a button, which is great. It's the only bike I've tried where the modes actually seem useful. All others I think you just need the "mode" of knowing the throttle and using it accordingly for the conditions.
I realise I sound like I'm slowly trying to talk myself into owning one and I probably would if money allowed and the worries of horror stories were put aside. They are a very very popular well selling bike though, so there are bound to be a lot of people with problems who are vocal about them on the internet. I think it was mentioned earlier in this thread that with the extra cost of them I think people expect them to never have reliablility issues. Something goes wrong on a 7k adventure bike and you kind of feel it's not great but you know it was 7k. A bike you've paid 12k for has issues and you feel very differently about it. In reality it's all a substantial amount of money for whatever bike you get. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
I also know of people who have had plenty of reliabilty issues with Ducati, KTM and Moto Guzzi bikes. All premium cost, fairly new bikes.
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Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Another bonus is the BMW dealers are great. While my local Suzuki dealer is a dingy, oily, shed. The BMW is a posh, carpeted, warm showroom where you can sit and drink free lattes.
When I had the gearbox issue, they recovered the bike, gave me a brand new GS (850) as a loan bike and swapped the gearbox without me having to do anything. Suzuki on the other hand were terrible when I bought my brand new V-Strom. I had to call head office and get them to speak to the dealer so they would carry out a recall the dealer swore didn't need doing. While the work was being done they said, "Well we can give you a 125 scooter if you want, but you'll have to pay for insurance" If I ever buy a brand new bike again, it will be a BMW based purely on the service. Go to your local dealer, they normally have demos and let you take them out for a few hours. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
I'm working at home today and always have youtube reviews etc on in the background (part of where my interest in certain bikes comes from when you hear of real world user reviews.)
Currently listening to someone who had the top of the range Triumph Explorer 1200. In just under two years it didn't start properly from new. Triumph denied any problem. Then it stopped altogether and Triumph had it for two months during the best summer weather trying to sort electrical problems without even an apology, no courtesy bike and no updates or calls to the customer unless he pestered them. He pointed out that unfortunately when you come to get a new bike after that experience you find it really hard to go for the same brand knowing how you've been treated. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
I think the problem lies in the ubiquitous expression "German Engineering" - it has come to mean everything that is well built and perfectly functional - we even get it on shampoo now. Since BMWs are generally priced higher than most other makes we expect perfection. In the UK we view BMW cars as being upmarket, reliable products but if you read US car web sites (like jalopnik.com) they view them differently - ok for 1or 2 years then get rid of them before the bills start.
German engineering is good but it used to be much better (imho). |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
GS ? Done all my research 7yr ago. Bought a Honda! (Closest was a Yam S10)
Have a good look at UKGSER. Brilliant resource. i know lots of ex-owners with tales that make you shiver, going back to even the 1150. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
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The Crosstourer? |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
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It is heavy if you need to push it about. It’s not the proper 90deg. classic V4. TC is basic (big button to switch off anytime.) It replaced a much loved and ridden GSX14 so heavy and boingy ( Nitron on the CT rear) does not bother me. In fact I would say it would slaughter my SV 1000S everywhere apart from the track. Narrow tyres and wide bars on these “adv” bikes mean you can really boss and hussle them. You get proper quality road rubber for them these days. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
I love my VFR but the current 35mpg bugs me. Seems the Crosstourer gets similar.
The weight is heavy but ok and would be nicer if it carried it lower down. Very planted feeling when on the move though. Not sure I'd want to be higher up on it. |
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Many years ago a had a gsx750 and commuted 3 miles to work. Mpg suffered a bit as it spent a lot of time on choke, but the big cost was tyres, as it was an urban route constantly accelerating or braking. Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Yep, Fuelly is showing my VFR mpg is low compared to average. Some new plugs arrived yesterday and the tank is empty so will see how it goes on the next tanks with the new plugs fitted.
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Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
I was getting 39mpg at one point.
Crosstourer on Fuelly.. 44mpg http://www.fuelly.com/motorcycle/hon...osstourer/2013 Not a huge jump. I'd prefer in the 50s so I'd feel better about using it compared to our family car with 4 of us, dog, roofbox and luggage in, which currently does better than my VFR. My X reg duffer of a van does better than my VFR too. |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
Speaking of which...looking at KTM fuel efficiency! Their latest greatest most modern bikes are in the mid 30mpg?! How are they designing modern bikes to drink so much?
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Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk |
Re: Thoughts on the GS ?
^When the 1250 based range was announced social medias was awash with comments like " Well, if it's not 160HP I'm not buying it" The 1250 gained 25HP or so over the 1200 but lost 15NM torque at the same rpm.
We're in an age where bikers are idiots and all that matters is a dyno printout for some peepee waving, not how it carries 4 weeks worth of luggage and camping gear for 2 across pretty much any terrain. But also in an age where bikes are increasingly becoming strangled by Euro5 |
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