Exhaust and Number Plates - Police view
 

Ok there has been an awful lot of talk regarding having noisy exhausts and small no. plates...with people saying that its legal now etc etc :?

Well this forum was not the only source that i have heard these rumours and so i spoke to some colleagues in the know, they are responsible for teaching new traffic officers current legislation, so if anyone should know..then it is these guys.....

Their answers confirmed my beliefs....

No. plates: Should still conform to the standard sizes stated in Construction and Use, i.e 9x7 (depending on how many digits you have)
a good website - http://www.malplates.co.uk/legbike.html

Exhausts: Like wise with exhausts, they should be stamped with an E marking, those that have not for road use written on them are still not legal, if you remove your baffles that will also still be illegal.....

So nothing has changed...the legislation is the same as it was, MOT laws may have changed but this does not effect current Road Traffic Laws.... The police still can and will prosecute, give tickets etc.

So forget all the rumours...if i hear of any changes i will post them here!

Hope this helps people out... :D


Regards

Fraser

was there confusion on that then ? :shock:

I new the MOT had changed but never presumed road was any different to what it previously was...


Fair enuff :lol:

Same, but confirmation is handy.

Cool post thanks Fraser

Re: Exhaust and Number Plates - Police view
 

I have never seen anyone claiming that an exhaust stamped as not for road use was now legal. The claim has been made that if an exhaust is not stamped at all it is OK for the MOT subject to the MOT testers subjective comparison of the noise level with with similar engined machines

But this is an untenable situation. If I understand your sumisation correctly I can get my bike MOT'd then be stopped by the police and given a rectification notice and then return to the MOT and get the notice signed without making any change to the bike. What a waste of all of our time.

The MOT no longer requires an E-Number to be stamped on the exhaust

[quote]So forget all the rumours...[quote]

This is not rumour it is policy as issued to the MOT testing stations

Not me I am more confused than ever.

Patch,

You are never happy.....there is nothing to get confused about....

The legislation relating to construction and Use has not changed....it is still the same.....as i said, this is the police view not an MOT view....if there are contradictions then that is for the goverment to take up....the purpose of the thread is to give someone an insight to how the police view the situation. I have also had rumours from many different sources...as i said originally not just this forum...if your not happy with the content of this thread then feel free to ignore it...

Happy biking :wink:

Thanks for the post Fraser. i was waiting for your info after reading that other thread on here a few days back.

I'd rather be aware of how the cops feel about my bike and worry about the MOT just on the day. At least the MOT guy aint gonna make me produce and slap me with a fine ;)

I get what Patch means about these quirks in the laws cross refrencing ability but thats so true of so many laws its a bit of a joke at times anyway.

Yep, I see exactly where Patch is coming from and for what it's worth I think he's right- since any rectification notice will be completed to MOT standard there's not much point in applying different standards to the penalties... but thanks a lot Fraser for letting us know what the situation is. Very interesting to know.

I suppose we should be grateful its at least easier to squeeze a few things through the MOT :D

I'm sure the police would also wish everything was a level playing field as then it would be much clearer, but harder on us MOT wise, Ive no doubt

I get what your saying Patch, its odd that there are discrepancies between MOT and Construction and Use.

Thanks for the info Fraser :D

Move to biking issues???

Thanks for the information, always good to have someone on the inside.

Out of interest, has anyone actually been pulled for a race can? If so what was said?

i was ince :D

Perhaps you could ask those in the know what exact legislation they refer to, by Act and section number. It would be interesting to know from where their police get the power

And my post represents the view of the punter. If I have a silencer fitted which has been subject to inspection by a certified MOT tester and found to be compliant how would your colleagues deal with a nutter such as me who challenged them to take me to court over it.

No desire to ignore it I am genuinely interested in all perpectives, after all as Sun Tze says in his work The Art of War - "Know your Enemy as you know yourself"

Always :D

See, I feel sorry for the Police, being landed in this situation... can't make the job any easier can it?

can i ask a question fraizer ?
do you have a tinted visor, small plate or a race can ? he he he

cheers for finding out for us all BTW.

moved to biking issues, bit more appropriate there

Its great in it.

Thats why i dont faff around with all this baffle stuff. I have race can, small plate. If i get done i get done simple. The officers are doing thier job, rightly or wrongly, well rightly. At the end of the day, no its not the end of the world that we have a race can, and yes there are more heniuos(sp?) crimes, but a law is a law no matter how silly, and if you break it and get causght, then tough titty!

However, what Fraser and patch say just highlights the complicatedness of it all, and that sometimes, legslation/rule changes conflict with each other.

As KeithD's sig says, its all bolloz init, and you cant say fairer than that.

yeah........me too..

not!

breakinthelawbreakinthelaw...

Cheers for that Fraser, although most of it was fairly obvious, I'm sure it has helped clear some points up for people EG, I didn't know if you had a 6 digit registration number, you could legally have smaller plates, albeit of a given size.

Just out of interest on the matter of race/illegal exhausts (I mean out and out illegal ones- not baffleable ones with the baffle removed), what doe people do re: insurance? Will your insurer issue you a quote/policy, even if you declare it? Surely if you have an (undeclared) illegal exhaust, it's a sure-fire way for them to get out of paying out (as technically it's a performance modification, as well as an aesthetic one, you can sort of see their point)?

Do you just insure it as a stock can, or perhaps the road legal version of your illegal can? Perhaps the insurers will happily insure an illegal can?
I have little interest in changing my can- I'm just intrigued...

Here we go again! :lol:

spot on viney.

well my origional can was scratched up, and i took it to a dealer who said he could replace it with a standard one for 600 quid, or one made my another company for 200 quid.

how was i supposed to know it was a race can ? :wink:

Yes, I may have an "undeclared" non-standard (albeit not race) replacement exhaust on my car. How exactly am I supposed to know? I took it to a garage and they charged me for a replacement. Am I suppose to jack it up and crawl underneath to take a look? :)

Oh come on gang........ Talk about making mountains out of molehills.... :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

You technowaffle-heads are causing huge migrains amoungst us mere mortals of the engineering and 'dabbling' world. Your convo's on simple things like cans are driving me potty...... :roll:

"NOT FOR ROAD USE" - Legal yes or no


Is it that hard to say they are illegal or legal??????????????? :?: :?: :?:

Confirmation here would be appreciated by all members of the 'sane' human biking race............... :D


Cracking Migrane
AKA
Splosh
xxxxx

Exactly as it says on the tin.
Not for road use means illegal and will not pass an MOT.

Fraser said that in his original post.

No, no and no......

anymore questions :D

and bikageboy...you welcome.......... :wink:

Most coppers I have met admit to having dark visors (they actually agree that they are better) and sometimes "non standard" exhausts. But even the dark visor thing is ridiculous; as far as I am aware, you may have up to a 20% tint on your visor, but there is no legislation to cover how dark my sunglasses can be when I ride/drive...... Now that's silly !

.

Definately... It's nonsense like that that must drive the cops mental... if I didn't use my dark visor on winter's mornings I'd be a danger- shades just dpn't work as well- and to their credit both times I was stopped this year the traffic cops gave me no grief at all over that.

Thats right mate, i have my own views on the kit, and if you know me and have had time to chat to me in person then that will become apparent, obviously i have to be careful what advice i give out on the forum as peeps know what i do for a living...wouldnt want to give them false information, but yes i understand what your saying about the visors and exhausts.... but sun glasses you can just take off....bit more difficult for a visor....however if the visor is up and your wearing sunnies then they have to comply with the legislation....i.e be shatterproof etc.....

really ? i never knew that.

Yeah was told about the sunglasses by the instructors when doing the CBT.

I have both an illegal exhaust and sometimes a visor. But I minimise my chances of gettng pulled by carrying a clear visor and by riding sensibly.

The only times I have been stopped by the police has been at the docks on my way to and from Ireland. Once cause my number plate had dropped off and once for looking suspicious I guess. They had a look round the motorbike but even though the exhaust says 'Not for road use' the police never mentioned it. The ART exhaust is loud though and trying to start the bike in the Customs shed without it making too much noise is hard :-)

Im about to become an enforcer of the law and while i changed my race can for a road legal baffled one, my plate is slightly smaller than standard. I understand that instructors of bikesafes and ridewells turn a blind eye to these when instructing as it would discourage many riders from attending these sessions. I use a tinted insert rather than a tinted visor, purely because i dont like carrying a spare everywhere i go.

Like Couerdelion I too have an Art can. I could be picky and say, "What if I grind the 'Not for Road Use' off?"

I'm not too fussed about having a standard sized plate, it's on a curvy and doesn't look like a sail. But I love my Art and take the view that as long as I don't act the tw@ I shouldn't get pulled. That philosophy has largely worked in a car (except for Gatso's) - When I have been pulled in a car I have got away with whatever I was doing - the worst being a producer following speeding - thankfully they didn't try sticking a speed on me (I was tanking it on a B road at the time, they dropped their argument when I explained I was driving a diesel Austin Maestro, I somehow forgot to tell them about the rather aggressive turbo on the Perkins engine! It was my Dad's car - he laughed when he found out - I think he was a little proud of me!)
Similarly I don't open the throttle too much in built up areas as that is asking for trouble. Get your road positioning right, show that you understand hazard perception and that you respect other users and local inhabitants and you seem to be unnoticed, or better still left alone. (I think the latter is better as it highlights that some of us are sensible and think as we ride)

Totally agree with that, my can is illegal too, but i dont ride like a loony in the city, nice high gear to save on fuel.

If a police car rolls by, clutch in throttle off :lol: :lol:

Quick question for fraser, my visor is illegal, police folk dont seem to mind to mind it, but just incase, what if my visor is up?

Is it still illegal to have a tinted visor but not using it?

Fraser
perhaps you could just run us through the fiasco regarding plain visors up/down used with sunglasses, prescription plain specs, prescription tinted specs, prescription sunglasses, prescription reacto-lite specs etc.

OK, OK, a bit of a wind up, but seriously, I've been searching for chapter and verse but can't find it written anywhere.

I do indeed wear prescription plain, tinted, full sunglass and reactions specs.

ive been thinking ?
shouldnt we have a section alongside biking issues called "fraisers corner" ? our resident policeman answers all your questions ? :lol: :lol: :lol:

thats a good idea :thumbsup:
now he will never get a rest from work again :twisted: (evil laugh)

He can always claim being here is work, good PR and all that. :wink:

I guess that it could be considered as community policing.

And maybe even worth a bit of overtime? :lol:

I agree that we should have a Legal Questions section tho.

I'm sure Fraser has better things to do than answer the same old questions over and over and over and over again. Most new riders/ site users are often asking the same questions...especially as the SV seems to be such a natural choice for those on their first big bike or those returning to biking.

I know my plate is smaller than it should be, but only very slightly. The cans legal when the baffle is in and i use the film inserts in my visors so i hope to be just onthe right side of the law if i get stopped.

I filtered down Muswell Hill the other day...over s olid white line cos there are roadworks at the bottom of the hill.... saw a marked car ahead and acted as if i was on my test (best behaiour / best riding) as i pulled up behind them. He waved me past....as if to say 'its ok...cross the solid white...i can see you are being sensible.'
result...gave him a :thumbsup: as i passed :D

Thank god for the likes of Fraser.... i really appreciate having a frienly knowledgeable ear on this forum to keep us all from breaking laws unknowingly. Nice one <doffs cap appreciatevly>

What are the implications of this then?

Take one race can stamped "not for road use" - Akrapovic for example, drill out the pop rivets in the end band. Reverse band inside out, use etching kit to etch on BS number, polish up and re rivet - good as new!!

Under the new zero tolerance of anything some politician can get publicity out of rules you gotta be looking at 5 years hard labour for that :twisted: