Question re Marine laws...

Since the .Org is the oracle of all knowledge, humanly possible or otherwise, I thought I'd ask the below. At the moment, as it's early days, I'm going to keep it as generic as possible.

What I'm interested in, is lien's & subsequent sales.

From my understanding, for example with mooring fees going unpaid, the Marina can place a lien on the vessel (prohibiting movement until the debt is settled). Whilst the lien is in force, the Marina can continue to charge a nominal storage fee, but all costs must be specified on the lien otherwise it's not enforcable. A copy of the lien must be sent to the owner of the vessel, or at least sufficient evidence be available showing that a search for the owner was unsucessful.

Once the debt reaches the value of the vessel, the Marina can put a "notice of intent to sell" on the vessel. Again, this notice must be served to the owner (if located).

At that point, the Marina are quite within their rights to sell the vessel to recover their costs incurred (unpaid fees, plus other associated costs).

Have I been informed correctly? Can anyone expand on any complications to the above (other than mortgage companies etc being involved as stakeholders)?

Much obliged.

Can the Marina value the boat low and buy it itself and then sell for a profit?

I dont have any idea.....

Originally Posted by ivantate

Can the Marina value the boat low and buy it itself and then sell for a profit?

I dont have any idea.....

It has to be valued (to my knowledge) at what would reasonably be expected to be market value depending on condition of the vessel and contents within it.

However, further to the above, determining value of contents becomes more of a baliff type issue, and they never give things market value.

Naturally though, expenses incurred in obtaining a value (for example, breaking into the vessel then subsequently securing it again) can be subtracted from market value.

But when a 19ft boat sells in excellent condition for £16500 (for example), and a local Marina has fees for that size vessel at £5000/year - how long does it take the owner not to pay fees before they can't afford to get the boat back? Then apply the same logic for a boat in a bad state of repair.

Should a boat be left on a mooring for prolonged period, and have gas bottles aboard etc, then Health & Safety also becomes an issue, and removal of such items for the safety of other vessels is also an activity the Marina can apparently bill for.

Not a lawyer. In fact my only qualifications are that I once worked in a law firm and I once lived on a marina and got a lift to the train station most mornings on a canal boat (not as fun as you might think, walking would have been quicker). Oh, and I've got a Bronze Swimming Certificate.

Don't see why not, you can obviously apply such charges to houses and you can also do the same thing to aircraft that haven't paid for hangering etc. As I understand it (not a lawyer remember) the mortgage company always gets first dibs, then other charges against the property are recovered on a first come first served basis (ie. whoever puts the first charge on the property gets their cut first). Again, if I've understood correctly the owner doesn't necessarily need to be informed (making every reasonable effort to do so is enough, success isn't a requirement). Wheras charges against houses are easy enough to recover because at some point the sale process always goes through official bodies, with property such as a boat it's harder to enforce at that point (esp if no mortgage companies are involved); I would guess that the effective process ends up being similar to how a baliff comes in and records all your valuables - at that stage there's nothing practically stopping you getting shot of the goods but legally the baliff has an interest on your telly and selling it without consulting the baliffs opens yourself up to.... dunno what it would be - contempt of court, something like that?

Now, for general Liens, most of what you say is true. But Marine Liens are slightly different.

Most notably, there is a specific (and well defined - legally) set order of precidence should multiple Liens exist on any given vessel. They are always paid out in order of priority (as you rightly said, mortgages come first).

Also, it's pretty hard to be in contempt of court unless there's already been a court order made. Until the order is made, any baliffs are merely acting as agents of the creditor (unless they "buy" the debt from the creditor, in which case the baliff company is the creditor for all intents and purposes).

I've been doing a fair amount of digging into the subject the last few days, and so far, I'm liking what I'm seeing.

Anyone with more input, it would be very much appreciated.

[Spiderman]

If Stingo dont see this it may be worth sending him a PM as one of our resident floaty on water people.