Damaged fork oil seals, checking cause.

This evening after a brief run on the bike I discovered both my fork oil seals were leaking quite badly. So much so that I don't want to use the bike till it's fixed. I believe I know what the cause is, but as I'm just using my deduction and haven't heard of it happening before, I wanted to confirm that this is possible (or better still, the most likely culprit).

The bike has been off the road the past 2-3 weeks and as I knew I wasn't going to be around to move the tyres, to stop the tyres developing flatspots, I put the bike up on stands. I've done this in the past with no ill effects. This time however, I had a headstock stand which is more stable/easier to use, so I used this on the front end. Only now has it occurred to me that unlike a normal front paddock stand, this leaves the front forks uncompressed, possibly putting a strain on the oil seals. Does this sound like it could be the cause?

The bike concerned is an SV650s K4. The fork internals were replaced about 3500 miles ago with Matris fork internals.The bike handled excellently and I was very careful to follow the instructions when assembling them, so I'm almost certain I assembled the forks correctly. I did, however, notice when putting them back together that they seemed comparatively harder to compress than when they had OE internals, but put this down to the old internals being so soft/worn out. Thinking about it though, this does mean it could have meant additional strain on the seals.

Not sure if it'd make a difference, but I replaced the fork oil seals with these:
http://shop.wemoto.com/pictures.dyn?u=5835676qqq3622478
when I fitted the new internals. They seemed identical to OE items and were a nice fit.

I didn't replace the bushes (weren't particularly worn and I didn't have spares to hand). I didn't replace the dust seals as the ones I got from Wemoto:
http://shop.wemoto.com/pictures.dyn?u=5835676qqq25674
(tourmax fork dust seal kit FSW-02 didn't fit very well and were too loose.

Stanchions are like new- no pitting that could have caused this.

I'm 99% sure the fork seals weren't leaking when I put the bike up on the stands as I'd regularly been checking them when the internals were bedding in and I'd actually been looking in that area when fitting a new brake line the day before I put it up on the stands and had checked them then.

I'm pretty much resolved to the fact I'll have to replace the seals, but before I do it, I'd like to ascertain that this is the most likely cause and that it's not something else and hence it won't happen again once I've replaced them with new ones. As I'd really like to be able to use the bike tomorrow/next week, what are people's opinions on using the old oil seals (which I still have) as a temporary measure till I can order some new OE ones (and may as well get some new OE dust seals at the same time)? Also, if it's okay to do this, just in case I can't find save enough of the existing fork oil/find anywhere selling it tomorrow, is there any other sort of oil that'd be commonly available (Halfords etc.) that would do the same job without knackering the seals/internals?

NB: I should mention that despite what my avatar might suggest I've not wheelied the bike since I fitted the new fork internals.

TIA mighty .org

[yorkie_chris]

In stock forks it's the damper rod that is the stop for the fork topping out. I think it should be the same for the matris stuff.

Halfords sells fork oil last time I checked.

[punyXpress]

Was it cold enough for ice to have formedaround the seal/stanchion?

Ceri, please keep in mind that when you installed the Matris internals (I've done this too they're great), you also replaced the oil with 7.5wt which was supplied together with your new internals. Lighter oil will leak out easier than thicker stuff so seals must be really solid. So you can less afford to keep old seals in but must almost surely replace with new, and from my experience it's better to go with the OEM stuff in this case. I've had some issues with other aftermarket stuff.

Originally Posted by zunkus

Ceri, please keep in mind that when you installed the Matris internals (I've done this too they're great), you also replaced the oil with 7.5wt which was supplied together with your new internals. Lighter oil will leak out easier than thicker stuff so seals must be really solid. So you can less afford to keep old seals in but must almost surely replace with new, and from my experience it's better to go with the OEM stuff in this case. I've had some issues with other aftermarket stuff.

Ta Zunkus that's probably it, this is the course of action I've decided upon as it was still leaking badly (albeit less than it was) after replacing the seals with the old OE ones yesterday.

YC: You're right, the damper rod stops it topping out, I was just wondering if forks being fully extended (well as far as the damper rod will allow) would put more pressure on the seals.

Punyexpress: No, bike was in the garage and no signs of ice.

Lighter oil wont leak out any easier than 20w will. Thats an internet falacy.

More than likely as the bike has been stood the seals have torn when you moved the bike. Did you oil the seals prior to installing them?. It happens a fair bit to any used stock we have that has sat around in the showroom.

Originally Posted by SV650Racer

Lighter oil wont leak out any easier than 20w will. Thats an internet falacy.

More than likely as the bike has been stood the seals have torn when you moved the bike. Did you oil the seals prior to installing them?. It happens a fair bit to any used stock we have that has sat around in the showroom.

I can't remember for sure, but I don't think so. I take it you cover them with fork oil? Do you need to leave them to soak in oil, or is it just a case of a quick coat all over seconds before fitting? Is it worth putting red rubber grease on the upper side of them (where oil shouldn't be getting to) to help prevent it from denaturing over time?

Yes you need to apply some red grease prior to fitting on the non oil side and a bit of fork oil onto the stantion and inner side of the seal. If the bike is sat for a while also worth just putting some WD40 or light oil onto the stantion and then bouncing it up and down a few times. Remember though to wipe off prior to riding.

Originally Posted by SV650Racer

Yes you need to apply some red grease prior to fitting on the non oil side and a bit of fork oil onto the stantion and inner side of the seal. If the bike is sat for a while also worth just putting some WD40 or light oil onto the stantion and then bouncing it up and down a few times. Remember though to wipe off prior to riding.

Thanks for the tips, very much appreciated. I'll fit the new seals this way and hopefully that'll solve the problem.

Just to clarify so I know whether or not it's safe to do in future, I take it using the headstock paddock stand while the bike was laid up wouldn't have made a difference?

Originally Posted by Ceri JC

Thanks for the tips, very much appreciated. I'll fit the new seals this way and hopefully that'll solve the problem.

Just to clarify so I know whether or not it's safe to do in future, I take it using the headstock paddock stand while the bike was laid up wouldn't have made a difference?

It wouldnt make a difference really no. What can burst seals is strapping a bike down, IE into a van and pulling the forks down very hard on ratchet straps.