Congestion Charge London

Originally Posted by Fizzy Fish

Sorry, didn't I just say that there are no plans for bikes to pay congestion charges??

Oh and the revenue raised from them goes to fund public transport improvements, to help accomodate those who switch due to the charges. Sadly it doesn't go into my pockets, or those of any of the big council men that I know...

Ive read that they might be in other cities which have recently been granted the ability to introduce their own congestion charges.

Originally Posted by ThEGr33k

Ive read that they might be in other cities which have recently been granted the ability to introduce their own congestion charges.

what, you mean there are cities other than London??



btw BMF and MAG do a lot of work to lobby for bikers' rights - if you feel strongly about this type of thing (and in fact even if you don't) you might like to join to add your support/funds to their campaigns

Originally Posted by Fizzy Fish

what, you mean there are cities other than London??

There will soon be others from what i hear!

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

Why should drivers pay for buses?

well you need to provide something as an alternative to those who you're pushing out of their cars, and actually that's the sort of thing which people who pay the congestion charge want to hear that it's going into.

Maybe sounds a bit odd, but of you think about it if you still drive your car and others now take the bus/tube (instead of staying in their car and paying the charge because there's no decent alternative), then you benefit from having clearer streets to drive on.

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by Fizzy Fish

well you need to provide something as an alternative to those who you're pushing out of their cars

But if they didn't put money into the completely cr@p public transport system then they wouldn't need the stealth tax, and people would be able to afford to drive.
IMO public transport when run properly, i.e as a business can work and make money, off its own back without being bailed out by the general public being conned. So why should motorists pay for a service they choose not to use?

Better than going to dole scum imo... Guess thats the only constelation!

[lukemillar]

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

But if they didn't put money into the completely cr@p public transport system.....

Erm... London's public transport systems is actually (IMO) one of the best I have experienced in various cities I have visited. I certainly wouldn't call it cr@p.

I agree with luke. The best thing about going to london the couple of times ive been was going on the underground!

Most of the city is pretty dull. Gimme Sheffield any day. Oh and Oxford street sucks!

The tube is fine if you're visiting, but try using it at peak time and then paying through the teeth for it.

Manchesters congestion charge scheme doesn't exempt bikes....

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

But if they didn't put money into the completely cr@p public transport system then they wouldn't need the stealth tax, and people would be able to afford to drive.
IMO public transport when run properly, i.e as a business can work and make money, off its own back without being bailed out by the general public being conned. So why should motorists pay for a service they choose not to use?

the problem is that a free market for say bus services tends to neglect the non-profitable routes in favour of the more profitable ones, so you end up with some areas not being served at all, even though there are people who are reliant on the bus to get to shops & essential services. So some sort of intervention/subsidy is always going to be needed to cover this.

totally agree though that public transport outside of London is generally pants, which is why people have been deserting it for ages. The reality is that given the choice between car/bike and public transport noone chooses the latter, no matter how good - unless they can't afford a car/are unable to drive.

The result is increasing congestion and vehicle emissions, which costs businesses money, increases the time it takes you to get to work, etc and increases heath problems. This scenario also further puts people off cycling/walking, which are the most sustainable ways to travel. So doing nothing isn't always an option, well that is if you think these any of these things are important.

BTW I'm not necessarily supporting congestion charging schemes, just pointing out the other side of the story! It's a difficult one to sort out, and any solution is going to involve some amount of making people do things that in an ideal world they'd prefer not to do. The important thing is to try and get people to make the switch by choice, and for those who don't to make the transition as easy/pleasant as possible.