Tarred & Feathered

Ok sticking purely to vigilantism then Nope, not justifiable. And yes, I do consider myself normal The thing is, it's driven by the fear that there is more crime than "back when I were a lad" and punishments are softer than "back when I were a lad". The thing is, I remember my parents saying the exact same thing. And their parents probably said the same.

It's an inevitable effect of OLD AGE - you start getting more worried by crime and start getting more nostalgic about THE OLDEN DAYS.

The facts however are different, almost every conceivable crime survey has shown that overal crime levels are at the lowest they've ever been, and the prison population is currently at the highest it's ever been. Ergo, crime is not as bad as it used to be, and punishments are actually harsher than they used to be. What has gone up over the years however is media frenzy, and this is undoubtedly driving the feeling that things are getting worse and no-one's doing anything about it.

Originally Posted by MiniMatt

The facts however are different, almost every conceivable crime survey has shown that overal crime levels are at the lowest they've ever been, and the prison population is currently at the highest it's ever been. Ergo, crime is not as bad as it used to be, and punishments are actually harsher than they used to be. What has gone up over the years however is media frenzy, and this is undoubtedly driving the feeling that things are getting worse and no-one's doing anything about it.

Interesting point. I don't know about your stats there, but I totally agree with the statement about the media. good news never sells papers - tragedy and death does however. Look at the states. People are terrified of everyone, terrorists, minorities, junkies, blah blah blah, all these people are evil, blah blah - go buy a gun and take the law into your own hands quick...

People who do this sort of thing are making a mockery of the law. Yeah they might deter one or two criminals, but it makes the police look like mugs to the community as well - not good.

[timwilky]

the problem with "Back when I was a lad" is that in my youth, you went to borstal, several of my friend did and never offended again. Now it seems you get a caution, then another, then an asbo, then probation, then a suspended sentence and finally you may get locked up, but not for too long as three to a cell and doing your business in buckets is not nice.

People use the system and get away with things for far too long. criminal behaviour needs to be nipped in the bud, not allowed to florish

Originally Posted by philbut

Interesting point. I don't know about your stats there

Well spotted, I'm normally the one who bemoans people quoting statistics without citations to back up their claims

Home office report at http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs07/hosb1107.pdf

Selected quotes:
•

Since 1995, all vehicle theft and domestic burglary have each fallen by over a half (61 per cent and 59 per cent respectively), and vandalism has fallen by 11 per cent, according to the BCS. Other household thefts have fallen by 47 per cent since 1995

The BCS shows violent crime has fallen by 41 per cent, with assault with minor injury falling by 58 per cent since 1995

It's an inevitable consequence of our failing judicial system that people will take the law into their own hands. A large part of the "point" of law is that the victims feel justice has been done. If they don't feel this, it's hardly surprising (not that I condone it) they do something about it themselves.

[tinpants]

Originally Posted by RhythmJunkie

I don't condone drug selling of any kind but we have to put this in perspective.....doctors and pharmacists sell drugs, they sell the really harmful ones which kill far more people than the illegal ones do.

The strongest argument against illegal drugs is the one in which families are broken down or destroyed by drug use but from what I've seen of illegal drug use alcohol breaks down more families, relationships and friendships and causes more anti-social behaviour than illegal drugs ever do and its legal...

It also kills more people!

The ones who make money from allowing the illegal drugs industry to flourish are the ones who should be tarred and feathered IMO!

Firstly, just what f***ing planet are you on? If any doctor or pharmacist sells drugs where you live, you should report them. Also, if you are going to make wild claims like this then you should be able to name some of these killer drugs. So please do.

Secondly, are you implying that medical professionals are responsible for more drug related deaths than drug dealers? If so, I feel extremely insulted that you could think this. I have NEVER sold any prescription drugs to anyone. I've prescribed loads during my time in the ambulance service but never, ever sold any. Neither has anyone I know of. It may be your opinion which, of course, you are entitled to. However, in this instance, please stuff it up your fundamental orifice and disappear from whence you came.



Having said that, I do agree with your comment about alcohol.

[northwind]

Originally Posted by Jabba

Assuming that they got the right person, that he is a drug-dealer, and that the Police failed to act on information received, is this action justified?

Too much to assume. This is why we don't do vigilantiism- they have a depressing habit of getting it completely wrong and beating up podiatrists. And this is because vigilantes get to act on assumptions, instead of facts.

Also, if it was the UDA who did it as is suggested (since we're assuming), they weren't clamping down on "drug dealing scumbags", they were removing a competitor.

Also, what drugs? In my mind there's a world of difference between a heroin/crack dealer and someone who flogs a bit of weed. Anyone who went to college in the last fifty years is probably still friends with a weed dealer

Followed by:

This isn't about whats right or wrong with regards to drugs taking, thats a topic for another thread.

This is about Vigilanteism, and how normal members of society are starting to feel that in order to get "Justice" they have to take matters into their own hand.

Yes mate!

Correct me if I'm wrong...I'm sure you'll try...but isn't the attack on a local drug dealer? Isn't that what the attack was all about? Isn't it the selling of drugs that's supposed to make it justified?

The local beat will have to find somewhere else to score a joint on a quiet night now won't they??? Welcome to the real world!!!

Secondly, are you implying that medical professionals are responsible for more drug related deaths than drug dealers?

Am I implying? Oh fer gawds sakes go do the research I did!
My son was doing some topic on drugs at school and I researched this stuff for weeks.

Whats the f***ing difference between a prescribed opiate pain killer from a doctor and an opiate high from a drug dealer? I'll tell you what...the pharmacy gets a bigger mark up!
Oh and you can thank Mr Bush for securing the future supply from Afghanistan.

You got magistrates doing coke and tv presenters on pills and the local beat having a crafty joint between shifts jeeeeezus I've seen it with my own eyes and you come back at me with..."are you implying"!

..and no I'm not paranoid I just walk around with my eyes open, unlike most people!

Also, if it was the UDA who did it as is suggested (since we're assuming), they weren't clamping down on "drug dealing scumbags", they were removing a competitor.

Nail squarely whacked on head there mate!