This is a travesty of justice!

[Red Herring]

Originally Posted by Fallout

The irony there is, if you do advanced riding, they will teach you to start on the outside of a left hand bend. The idea being that you have better visibility round the corner and can get to the inside sooner if something is coming, but still, you would've been in more danger if you'd done it 'properly'.

I think the real irony is that you clearly haven't a clue about what you are saying.....

The whole idea, as you did say, of being in a central "offside" position on the approach to a left hand bend is so that you can see a tad further which will give you more time to plan and react to what you see.

So when you see the front of a large lorry approaching with it's front offside on or over the centre line you tighten your line and/or reduce speed so as to maintain a safety margin. Of course, if you also see that it is all clear you can maintain a higher speed (on the basis that you can see further) get on the throttle earlier and harder, and generally make better progress....

CA doesn't mention how tight this bend was or the speeds involved but I would suggest it must have been pretty tight for the trailer to have crossed to the centre of the oncoming lane, so it follows that his speed should have been pretty low as well. I'm not suggesting the lorry driver isn't at fault, if the bend was that tight then he should have clearly stopped if he saw an oncoming vehicle, but to suggest someone would have "been in more danger for doing it properly" is just plain daft.

Originally Posted by Red Herring

I think the real irony is that you clearly haven't a clue about what you are saying.....

The whole idea, as you did say, of being in a central "offside" position on the approach to a left hand bend is so that you can see a tad further which will give you more time to plan and react to what you see.

So when you see the front of a large lorry approaching with it's front offside on or over the centre line you tighten your line and/or reduce speed so as to maintain a safety margin. Of course, if you also see that it is all clear you can maintain a higher speed (on the basis that you can see further) get on the throttle earlier and harder, and generally make better progress....

CA doesn't mention how tight this bend was or the speeds involved but I would suggest it must have been pretty tight for the trailer to have crossed to the centre of the oncoming lane, so it follows that his speed should have been pretty low as well. I'm not suggesting the lorry driver isn't at fault, if the bend was that tight then he should have clearly stopped if he saw an oncoming vehicle, but to suggest someone would have "been in more danger for doing it properly" is just plain daft.

For my situation it was a 17 tonne ridged body hay lorry, the corner was pretty tight, but, it is quite a long corner. And even though it was national speed limit I had slowed down to about 30mph as I didn't have enough confidence to go fast through corners

Originally Posted by Red Herring

I think the real irony is that you clearly haven't a clue about what you are saying.....

The whole idea, as you did say, of being in a central "offside" position on the approach to a left hand bend is so that you can see a tad further which will give you more time to plan and react to what you see.

I agree with this, the first thing I learned with the IAM was to use the road to see what was coming round corners as much as possible, and then get the hell out of the way if a truck/tractor/lass driving a corsa on her mobile was coming round it. If not, proceed to make progress.

With the IAM I was told to ride in the same path of the car tyres. The middle of the road is the dirtiest and where oil from cars is more likely to fall.

Therefore on a left hand bend, I will be on the far(ish) right hand side of my
Lane and vice versa

Does it really matter where you were taught to ride, inside, outside, upside bloody down, if somethings coming is it not common sense to get out of the way? otherwise guess what's going to happen.

[Fallout]

I find it particular interesting how I haven't got a clue about what I'm saying, but what I was saying was apparently right.

That's some confusing irony right there. I'll be up all night trying to work that out.

So let me get this right. If you're going left, keep to the right and have a look up the left then go round the right and even if you're blind you can see to go straight round the corner. If you're going right, keep to the left and have a look up the right and when you've gone right keep to the left. Right?
It's no wonder I've never noticed anything worth crashing into in nearly 40 years of biking, I'm too busy looking where I'm going.

Its all to do with observation basically. The more you stay out before you turn the more you can see and obviously staying left through a right hander stops you crossing the white line.

[Red Herring]

Originally Posted by Fallout

I find it particular interesting how I haven't got a clue about what I'm saying, but what I was saying was apparently right.

That's some confusing irony right there. I'll be up all night trying to work that out.

Yeah, all right I was being a bit harsh, sorry. My point was that after saying the IAM advocate entering a left hander positioned towards the crown of the road you then went on to say that this would have been more dangerous, which tended to suggest you didn't have a grasp of why they encourage you to position there in the first place.....

I think we've done this point to death now......lets talk about right handers instead......

[Fallout]

Originally Posted by Red Herring

Yeah, all right I was being a bit harsh, sorry. My point was that after saying the IAM advocate entering a left hander positioned towards the crown of the road you then went on to say that this would have been more dangerous, which tended to suggest you didn't have a grasp of why they encourage you to position there in the first place.....

I think we've done this point to death now......lets talk about right handers instead......

That's cool mate. I didn't mean to come across as thinking advanced riding techniques were flawed. I'd rather be wide on the bend and see the truck sooner, so long as I had my wits about me and was ready to pull in.

As for ride handers ... love em!!