Electric Vehicles

[svenrico]

Originally Posted by Seeker

One man's hate for Tesla (yep, he's nuts).

https://jalopnik.com/watch-a-finn-bl...ite-1848261076


...and coming to a charging area near you: Elite Charging from Audi

https://jalopnik.com/audis-charging-...-pr-1848260130

What happens to EV batteries when they have reached the end of their life ?
There seems to be quite a few claims for the 'green' credentials of electric vehicles which don't take into account the disadvantages/ negative effects .

[admin]

Originally Posted by Seeker

On an unrelated note - has anyone been following the car industry plans to introduce subscription services? As an example if you bought the car with heated seats or remote start capability then after a set period you would lose that function unless you paid a subscription. The German car industry is particularly keen.

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...-a9599821.html

Tesla do something similar. When a new owner registers a used car, certain functions cease to work as they only apply to the previous owner. I'll see if I can find the story.

https://www.drive.com.au/news/tesla-...hem-privately/

Sent from my SM-T510 using Tapatalk

[svenrico]

Originally Posted by admin

Tesla do something similar. When a new owner registers a used car, certain functions cease to work as they only apply to the previous owner. I'll see if I can find the story.

https://www.drive.com.au/news/tesla-...hem-privately/

Sent from my SM-T510 using Tapatalk

Watch out used EV purchasers !

[Ruffy]

Originally Posted by Seeker

On an unrelated note - has anyone been following the car industry plans to introduce subscription services? As an example if you bought the car with heated seats or remote start capability then after a set period you would lose that function unless you paid a subscription. The German car industry is particularly keen.

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...-a9599821.html

Originally Posted by admin

Tesla do something similar. When a new owner registers a used car, certain functions cease to work as they only apply to the previous owner. I'll see if I can find the story.

https://www.drive.com.au/news/tesla-...hem-privately/

Sent from my SM-T510 using Tapatalk

I spy an opportunity for an aftermarket 'black box' manufacturer. When all is said and done an electric drivetrain is well understood: Electric motors, drives, batteries and chargers have been around for decades so operating them is technically well understood. The rest is just human-machine-interface computer stuff, again pretty straighforward to reverse engineer and replace.

I suspect the biggest impediment to getting around OEM control systems will be overcoming the motor insurance requirements, not the engineering.

[svenrico]

Originally Posted by Ruffy

I spy an opportunity for an aftermarket 'black box' manufacturer. When all is said and done an electric drivetrain is well understood: Electric motors, drives, batteries and chargers have been around for decades so operating them is technically well understood. The rest is just human-machine-interface computer stuff, again pretty straighforward to reverse engineer and replace. for some maybe !

I suspect the biggest impediment to getting around OEM control systems will be overcoming the motor insurance requirements, not the engineering.

Plenty to overcome then.

[Ruffy]

Originally Posted by svenrico

What happens to EV batteries when they have reached the end of their life ?

"End of life" is a less than clear-cut concept.

Once they're no longer suitable for traction use, many batteries are currently re-purposed for the large scale energy storage systems that are being developed to provide backup for renewable/intermitent generation grid systems. The reduced capacity of each battery (or individual degraded cells within the battery) is less an issue in a multi-MWh battery farm connected to the grid where the main challenge at present is about short-term transient ride-through ('synthetic inertia') rather than providing high-power sustained supply.

I'm not clear at what point they become useless for any purpose and become scrap (absolute end of life).

At whatever point, I understand that they can be effectively and quite substantially recycled for raw materials to be re-used (in theory at least - whether that actually happens is a different question).

[Ruffy]

Originally Posted by svenrico

Plenty to overcome then.

OK, not a 'man in the street' thing, but well within the bounds of reasonably equipped professional control systems/electronic engineers

(A friend who used to work in development for a major manufacturer once shared with me how they would periodically anonymously hire top-end new models to spend a period in the lab (cheaper and quicker than buying), where they would then tap into the wiring of the various data systems and systematically gather data stream traces to be able to assess functionality that they could then be able to compare with their own work. As they said to me, it's just a computer system, so it's much the same hacking/cracking process as, for example, working out how to exploit PC vulnerabilities. Why re-invent the wheel, as it were?!)

[svenrico]

Originally Posted by Ruffy

OK, not a 'man in the street' thing, but well within the bounds of reasonably equipped professional control systems/electronic engineers

(A friend who used to work in development for a major manufacturer once shared with me how they would periodically anonymously hire top-end new models to spend a period in the lab (cheaper and quicker than buying), where they would then tap into the wiring of the various data systems and systematically gather data stream traces to be able to assess functionality that they could then be able to compare with their own work. As they said to me, it's just a computer system, so it's much the same hacking/cracking process as, for example, working out how to exploit PC vulnerabilities. Why re-invent the wheel, as it were?!)

Yes, I take your point ,but it isn't something somebody buying a used EV wants to have to get sorted out . They just want to be able to drive the vehicle with everything working.

[Ruffy]

Originally Posted by svenrico

... but it isn't something somebody buying a used EV wants to have to get sorted out . They just want to be able to drive the vehicle with everything working.

I wholeheartedly agree.

(Makes me wonder if the car/bike custom culture that we have in the UK will gradually wane when EVs become more prolific or if the aftermarket will just change a bit to provide for a different market. Will large numbers of people still buy a used vehicle with the intent of 'doing it up' to their own taste? Or perhaps I have a distorted viewpoint and I'm badly extrapolating from quite a niche perspective?)

[DJ123]

Volvo has done a report on an ICE v BEV equivalent to map out the carbon footprint and the breakover point.

(results are form page 23 onwards)

https://www.volvocars.com/images/v/-...lca-report.pdf