Advanced riding – braking

Originally Posted by Blue_SV650S

I'd say it is worse than that ... if you are already 'partially loaded' in a corner and then need a bit more (for whatever reason) then the bike is already in the posture,no problem - however grabbing a bit from nowhere (suspension/weight distribution wise) in a turn has to be worse right?

Thats what I reckon.

Originally Posted by northwind

BUT! If you never ever brake in a corner, if you ever find yourself in a position where you have to brake in a corner, it will be the first time you ever do it and so it's far more likely that you'll crash. So I reckon a policy of total avoidance could rob you of skills that could make the difference between crashing and not crashing.

My view entirely. I am genuinely amazed at how many people claim never to brake in corners. Certainly, it's not something to try and do all the time on normal rides, but as a skill, it's essential. It's one of those things like when people claim, "I never use the back brake, at all". I don't really believe them, I just suspect that actually they do it unconciously, otherwise they'd be crashing all the time?


Edit: Oh yes and relying on good obs to be able to say, "I'll never need to brake round a bend." Isn't particularly bright IMO. What about cars pulling out of hidden side junctions on corners you've never ridden etc. vehicle in front (even a long way off) stands up on the brakes on a long sweeping bend etc.? I think you shouldn't plan to be trail braking into bends and should go in at the right speed, but when one of those "no way of seeing that" moments happen, you need to be able to do it.

Originally Posted by Ceri JC

What about cars pulling out of hidden side junctions on corners you've never ridden etc..

Ideally you will have spotted a road sign in your foward obs (assuming it was there) so hopefull should already be prepared for this scenario.

Originally Posted by Ceri JC

vehicle in front (even a long way off) stands up on the brakes on a long sweeping bend etc.? I think you shouldn't plan to be trail braking into bends and should go in at the right speed, but when one of those "no way of seeing that" moments happen, you need to be able to do it.

This has happened to me a couple of times - it wasnt a disaster because I was already expecting the unexpected (I do tend to err well on the side of caution most of the time!) I automatically throttled off and stood the bike up as much as possible before braking. (had brown trouser moment though!)

Originally Posted by ArtyLady

Ideally you will have spotted a road sign in your foward obs (assuming it was there) so hopefull should already be prepared for this scenario.)

I've had a 4x4 seemingly pull out from a hedge into my path. There was no sign and the angle of approach to the LH bend meant it wasn't visible (unless your observation allows xray vision ). Cars coming the other way, so braking on the bend was the only option.

Originally Posted by ArtyLady

This has happened to me a couple of times - it wasnt a disaster because I was already expecting the unexpected (I do tend to err well on the side of caution most of the time!) I automatically throttled off and stood the bike up as much as possible before braking. (had brown trouser moment though!)

Thing is, throttling off on an SV is effectively braking, albeit using the back brake. If you can't brake round a bend, surely the only way to ride safely is to be able to coast to a stop in the distance you can see to be clear. Even with the SVs engine braking this is a loooooong way at 60mph, compared to how quickly you can stop when braking round a bend without highsiding it. I wonder if those who can't brake round bends really do leave adequate stopping distance to deal with this?

Out of interest, is this such a controversial subject because people who can't brake round bends nearly crash into the back of those who can? Twice I've had other bikers confront me about this (and neither time was comfort braking- it was neccessary) and they don't seem to feel the usual rule of "you rear end someone, your fault" applies when going round bends for some reason.

the expensive lesson i learned braking into corners was running the front tyre with too much pressure in (silly immature mistake i know), i normally ride hard on the front relying on the front tyre for maximum grip, personally i always brake in corners and was surprised how well my sv650s coped with it.

Originally Posted by Blue_SV650S

- purposely slide the rear about, not only is it a giggle, but sliding the rear about lets you know how much grip there will be for the front/tipping in ...

They don't last that long your tires do they?

Originally Posted by Dave The Rave

They don't last that long your tires do they?

Its not like I don't do it in the dry but I was specifically talking about in the wet there ... you don't get much 'wear' slipping a bit in the wet as you are sliding on a layer of water/mud/grime!

Oh and remember to get the back end out/skidding a bit it doesn't have to be locked up, just slower than road speed ...

Anyway back to main topic ...

If braking in a straight line is the only accepted method, it is clear to me that I would never pass an IAM test. ... I also know now that I have no interest in doing it as I don't believe in half what I read (I had been flirting with the idea, hence reading the book in the first place).

I can see some flaws in the method (setting speed before turning in), but I think it probably is the 'safest' ... why?? coz if you have set your seed before every turn, you would have to be going so dog slow at corner entry that the end of the world could be nigh round the bend and you would stop in time!! .. Couples with rule 2 (or whatever) then if it is a blind bend with trees and hedges (like I tend to ride), you have zero forward observation, therefore would only be able to do 10mph anyway ... safe? ... sure ... fun??? ... fast??!!? I can't see that!!!!!

I am not saying that it isn't a well established method, or that MY method is better/the IAM way is wrong, just I personally choose NOT to want to ride that way!

I am sure, somewhere in the back of my mind, that tyre wear is increased in wet weather riding.

[yorkie_chris]

How come they say wet miles dont count when scrubbing in new tyres?

well firstly i have given abit of rear brake when i have clearly slightly miss-judged a corner, only a light touch though, and never felt not in control or whatever

also on my cbt i was advised that if you are going to brake in corner, use the rear brake, people are saying grabbing the brakes? are these handfuls referring to the front brake? and not rear?