Are schools ruining our society? Advice.

Originally Posted by Lozzo

Jesus wept.

When I was 5 years old my mum used to wave me off at the garden gate, from where I'd walk half a mile with my two elder sisters to catch a school-bus from Serangoon, where we lived in Singapore, to Selerang School. To get to the bus-stop we'd have to cross one of the busiest roads in Singapore, the one that led from Serangoon to the airport. My sister's bus always arrived before mine by about 5 minutes, so me and my friends would wait patiently for ours to arrive.

On the return journey I would get off the bus and cross the road with friends, walk through a local kampong village and into our road alone, because none of my schoolfriends live nearby.

My ex had a similar trip to mine every day from the age of 8 until she was 16, when she attended a local all girls school in Bedford. She'd have to cross the main road, catch a bus into the centre of town and then negotiate a bus station and a couple of very busy roads before getting into school.

Neither of us had any problems and nor did our schoolfriends. My kids were encouraged to go out and toughen up in the same way I was. As soon as they were old enough to travel on a bus alone, that's what they did every day until they got driving licences and cars of their own.

We're breeding a nation of bloody wimps who can't do anything unless mummy holds their hand.

+1

Only met this bloke once but you cant argue he talks sense!

On the other note someone somewhere will have sued the school panic set in at others and they are lining up the teflon sheets as stated.

Schools have already turned into childcare. Think it's a case of "You can let your kid walk himself in but at your own risk."

Current climate of blame probably not unreasonable.

You can't compare what we did when Lozzo was 5 years old, we lived in a very different world in the 1940's.

Childcare - Primary schools have always had to care for the children to a certain extent, I remember standing in the playground holding a teachers hand and waiting because my mother had been delayed picking me up. If I fell they'd put a plaster on my knee, and if on a school trip they'd make sure I crossed the road safely and didn't get lost. Primary schools are educational, but at that age a level of childcare has always been required.

Walking to school is one thing, I used to cycle 2 miles to get to primary school, but being left to fend for themselves for a whole day is completely different.

I wonder how many parents allow their primary school children to walk to school nowadays. I have to say living in Birmingham it would worry me, but would I let him do it? When we did it, did our parents just pack us out the door and forget about us until we got home, or did it worry them too? Having dinner with my mother tonight, I'll ask her.

Pfft late 80's i walked to school across fields!

I also remember one teacher sat next to me on the way back on a coach trip with school and kissed me on the forehead (so i was told).

I suppose these days she'd have got sued for sexual harrasment personally at the time apart from being embrassed (ugh a girl mentality) i couldnt give a ****, lol.

Originally Posted by Messie

I think much depends on the actual wording of the letter tbh. I stringly suspect that the school is, rightly, saying it's not their responsibility outside the school gates, but that the OP has read into it that it means as far as the classroom. It may depend a lot on the time of day and when the child is being dropped off, rather than which bits of the school.
Our school gates are open from 6.30 am each day but we have made it clear that we cannot be responsible for students from that early time. We run a full duty system for 10 minutes before the first school bell to 10 minutes after and it's only between those times that we are fully responsible (unless they're in school for a school based activity/club/detention)

Lots of interesting thoughts above.

The school is saying they wont take responsibility until the child gets into the classroom. and want written confirmation saying I accept this risk for him to cross these potential harmful areas from me in the car to the classroom door.

I agree the real matter is probably A) limiting their own liability, B) and not having the resources to manage kids from the gate to class.

They were not clear on their letter though apart from saying I was putting my child at risk and they were not accepting this responsibility - even though they are on school grounds.

I have told them verbally I wont confirm this in writing...detention for me perhaps... They are meanwhile 'seeking advice on the matter'.

Originally Posted by Demonz

They are meanwhile 'seeking advice on the matter'.

Surprise, surprise! they really should have done that before writing the letter so they knew where they stand, then maybe they wouldn't have written it in the same way.

Messie, so the school are saying (in the letter at least, perhaps the tune will change once they have sought advice) that even if Demonz walked his son to the outer door, they won't take responsibility for him once in the building, unless Demonz takes him right to the classroom. Have the school asked Demonz to relinquish them of a responsibility, that Ofsted would say should sit with the school?

[Messie]

I really can't comment any further, because it all depends on some fairly specific particulars and I only know generalities.
I don't think Demonz is an irresponsible parent, nor do I think the school are being ridiculous. It may be a very badly worded letter (which the acting Head would be wise to reconsider) or it may be some sort of misinterpretation by Demonz. I'm sure that Demonz is taking perfectly adequate responsibility for his son but for some reason the school needs to clarify this.
I think the school will be seeking advice from their LEA about exactly where their duty of care, and therefore safeguading responsibilities lie. I really can't see how the school can be held responsible for the child's safety outside the school (indeed we are often told that because an event has taken place outside our school gates we can do nothing about it) but once inside the school is a very grey area, not least because of the time of day.
It makes me sad if parents see school as a 'them and us' situation - we really are all on the same side - that of your children.

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by Messie

You may have noticed, for example, that all schools are now getting high fences around them as one of the more obvious effects of this policy. It also includes us knowing details about absolutely everyone who on the school's premises at any time.

Yeah that started to come in just as I left school, it was apparently a right pain in the 'arris for my Brother a few years younger as you had to climb over it to get to the chippy.

H+S my 'rse, eating school food, now THAT'S bad for you.

Actually just before I left the school went on this "you WILL eat healthy" drive. Yeah great idea, sarnie shop down the road never did so good business.

Originally Posted by Messie

I bet loads of the parents on here would be the first to complain if their child got hurt somehow in school.

Depends how, I've no kids but I did get injured fairly regularly. I'm sure a complaint is due if a teacher sets fire to a kid, but sh*t happens and getting a little bit injured is the best way to learn a lesson.

All this sissy-b*ll*cks manner of teaching is useless. Nearly as appaling as the culture of rewarding a retarded, vile child while being indifferent to the motivated and intelligent.

[Messie]

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

Yeah that started to come in just as I left school, it was apparently a right pain in the 'arris for my Brother a few years younger as you had to climb over it to get to the chippy.

H+S my 'rse, eating school food, now THAT'S bad for you.



Depends how, I've no kids but I did get injured fairly regularly. I'm sure a complaint is due if a teacher sets fire to a kid, but sh*t happens and getting a little bit injured is the best way to learn a lesson.

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Not often I agree with you YC but school food is now 'healthy', thanks to Jamie Oliver. Our cook has an odd idea of healthy, and I take a packed lunch!

And most of us teachers are all for kids getting into scrapes and learning through some hard knocks, specially on things like adventure school trips. But sadly we're not allowed to do most of those anymore because of H & S. It's not us that wants to wrap kids in cotton wool - it's the softie scaredie compensation seeking parents who do

[Paul the 6th]

"Excuse me, do you mind if I finish work early so I can pick up the kids from school... before their parents get there" - Frankie Boyle

felt compelled to stick that one in there