Educashun...

[dizzyblonde]

Originally Posted by 454697819

Correct Foey,

Imho it starts at home, you cannot expect the education system to teach children from scratch as there is NO hope of that given how many children and all thier different problems,

I have whitnessed my 5 yr old cousin as a little genius start school and is now board because her mum did such a great job in the early years.

hey ho...

The key to the best start in a childs education, is to do everything you can possibly do before they turn four, before school. A child absorbs everything early on, walking, talking, recognition etc. So simple things like cat, dog, 1-10, colours etc as they are learning to walk and talk gives them an advantage for the academics at school

Tiz why my son is a nerd
I did everything possible with him, as advised by his godfather, whose daughter never so much as saw a TV during her childhood, was amused by other things than playstations, and given a lot of music to listen to, radio, and newspapers. Goes a long way, she did exceptionally well at school. Unfortunately, these days kids needs playstations, wiis and xboxes or they pull a dicky fit. Dylan has them. but in moderation, and TV too, although at the moment hes turning into a playstation zombie cause Asda fixed his Star Wars game!

[Bluepete]

I gave up on caring about such things years ago at a house in Openshaw.

The woman had several young children in the house, including a baby (think - Catholics in The Meaning of Life) She was smoking like a chimney as were the other adults.

My partner on that day pointed out that smoking could harm the children and slow their brain development. (not her place to point it out, but she did anytway)

The mother's reply?

"Oh, I don't want them growing up clever or anything"

Since then, I've lost count of the number of drunk pregnant mothers I've dealt with, how many houses look like they are on fire with tobacco smoke, how many kids are out of school when they shouldn't be.

Education isn't a priority. Getting pregnant, getting a council house and getting handouts is. They KNOW the system will provide. So why work hard to keep kids in school and help them get jobs?

Mrs BP is a teacher. She is superb at her job, the kids love her and she strives to educate them. But parents don't pull their weight. Education starts at home. Many parents, even at her school (middle class area, high parent numbers in work, low truancy) don't think they have any place in their children's education.

As for not knowing the months of the year, their 'phones will tell them the date, so why learn it?

Like life in the UK now, it's someone else's problem/fault, why should they have to do it/learn it?

And I was having such a lovely morning...

Pete

[dizzyblonde]

Originally Posted by kitkat

this is what is worrying me a bit. Libby is quite a bright wee thing, not 2 until xmas but she can recognise most letters of the alphabet and tell me what sound they make or tell me their name, does sign language and has started saying the word while signing. she knows all her colours and knows her shapes including oval, pentagon. But I worry that when she gets to school she will know too much and get bored. The infant school she will be going to had ofsted inspection last month and it is a good school with outstanding bits but "children start reception class with a well below average of knowledge and understanding". The english education system seems to take a bit to get going. In reception down here its like nursery, lots of learning thru play. In scotland you sit at a desk and learn to read and write. I like the idea of home schooling until maybe junior school age but worry about her not having pals, she is a quiet wee thing. My older kids treated school as a big social experience. dilema dilema

This is the problem we had with Dylan, other kids weren't quite as bright, theres six of the same ability as him in his class, and the rest vary. I wouldn't worry as teachers guage it pretty quickly, and manage to not bore the socks off the higher end. Reception was all learning through play here too, but Mrs Melhuish is the best teacher he has ever had in that school, the further hes got, the more I've been disappointed, he doesn't struggle, but they struggle to keep him at the level he should be, not because hes not capable, but because of boredom, disruption from other kids and the fact that he sometimes is not allowed his full potential. As for reading, he doesn't read the school books anymore, they bore him, and don't inspire him enough. At six he was graded as 'reading age of a nine year old.

This isn't saying 'my sons amazing' etc, there are many kids that a extremely bright, that get let down by education, and other doofus kids that are disruptive, who take up all the time of the teacher because they can't bloody behave in school. That problem stems from parents who can't be ar$ed to discipline and educate at home.

Originally Posted by missyorkie_chris

Great! Dilbert's first binoculars for his next birthday methinks!

LOL, he has a kids set now

sort of on topic but may warrent another thread, speaking to the wife (still feels weird saying that) just last night on her return home from parents evening (shes a teacher - all be it of Art but still the theory is the same). It frustrates her and her work mates alike that those kids who do well(ish) in school, those who actually do the work and dont spend lessons chucking pens/rubbers around the class room are the ones whose parents turn up. All this seems to be is an evening of infalting the ego's of the parents who are active in the attention they provide their child and his/her education.

The kids who are the problem childs, the ones who have in the past made her cry, scream, consider murder etc lol are the ones whose parents never show up on parents evening, the ones whose planners are never signed and the ones who oddly enough as she points out only wear trainers instead of the shoes required for uniform.

On that basis I too sit on the side of the fence which blames the parents, if they activly encouraged their child to get educated then that child would learn and for it, they'd go further in life. One of her pupils called Dom has some sort of learning disability and his parents give him so much support its made Abi cry with happiness, this kid shows more determination and will to learn than kids in the same class who are "normal" but dont have that domestic support. She's confident that Dom will do well in life inspite of his disability which is great for him. If only the other 20+ kids in the class could have the same said about them.

[andrewsmith]

I think this is one that will run and run.

Kids are getting stupider IMHO, but there are kids like Dizzy's and my cousins that are bright as buttons.

I'm from a roughish area and live opposite the school and some of the kids still have dummies in their mouths age 5. But it does come down to the parents in most cases, as I was made to do homework and all that, as me old man did not want me turning into what a lot of the local kids are like.

[dizzyblonde]

I think that teachers should be more like this one

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...shire-11661224

She was featured on local news this week, there was footage on how she teaches, really inspiring for kids. I can't find the clip though!

Wouldn't mind but these days class 4 have three teachers, I don't know their names, and don't know what they look like, is it really necessary for a primary class to have that many teachers, I don't think so.

[gruntygiggles]

Originally Posted by kitkat

this is what is worrying me a bit. Libby is quite a bright wee thing, not 2 until xmas but she can recognise most letters of the alphabet and tell me what sound they make or tell me their name, does sign language and has started saying the word while signing. she knows all her colours and knows her shapes including oval, pentagon. But I worry that when she gets to school she will know too much and get bored. The infant school she will be going to had ofsted inspection last month and it is a good school with outstanding bits but "children start reception class with a well below average of knowledge and understanding". The english education system seems to take a bit to get going. In reception down here its like nursery, lots of learning thru play. In scotland you sit at a desk and learn to read and write. I like the idea of home schooling until maybe junior school age but worry about her not having pals, she is a quiet wee thing. My older kids treated school as a big social experience. dilema dilema

I think you'll find the answer in your signature Hazel

In all seriousness though, If I could manage it and the local school was not up to scratch, I think I would definitely home school. It's a sad time when you have to consider it, but responsible parents will be thinking about their childrens futures and if it is you that can provide Libby with the best start, then "just do it". You can enrol in other social clubs and classes to help her socialise, but as you say, you wouldn't home school for all of her education...just the start of it.

Originally Posted by Bluepete

I gave up on caring about such things years ago at a house in Openshaw.

The woman had several young children in the house, including a baby (think - Catholics in The Meaning of Life) She was smoking like a chimney as were the other adults.

My partner on that day pointed out that smoking could harm the children and slow their brain development. (not her place to point it out, but she did anytway)

The mother's reply?

"Oh, I don't want them growing up clever or anything"

Since then, I've lost count of the number of drunk pregnant mothers I've dealt with, how many houses look like they are on fire with tobacco smoke, how many kids are out of school when they shouldn't be.

Education isn't a priority. Getting pregnant, getting a council house and getting handouts is. They KNOW the system will provide. So why work hard to keep kids in school and help them get jobs?

Mrs BP is a teacher. She is superb at her job, the kids love her and she strives to educate them. But parents don't pull their weight. Education starts at home. Many parents, even at her school (middle class area, high parent numbers in work, low truancy) don't think they have any place in their children's education.

As for not knowing the months of the year, their 'phones will tell them the date, so why learn it?

Like life in the UK now, it's someone else's problem/fault, why should they have to do it/learn it?

And I was having such a lovely morning...

Pete

Totally agree with the sentiments of the above post Pete. I would have to wake up at 5.30, ride a bike a 4 mile round trip to sort my pony out, home, shower, school....from the age of 6 to 16 and would have to do the same round trip after school. I would be home by about 7pm, eat, shower and while everyone else watched TV, I was expected to sit at the table and do my homework. My mum or dad would check it and then I was free to do what I wanted. I was never forced to do it, never felt like I was being unfairly treated. I did it because I respected my parents and when they said I had to do something...I did it.

You learn first from your parents...if they don't teach you respect, it is nigh on impossible for anyone else to be able to teach a child anything.

Originally Posted by andrewsmith

Kids are getting stupider IMHO, but there are kids like Dizzy's and my cousins that are bright as buttons.

Kids are as stupid as they every were. The only thing a baby really knows is how to suckle, the rest comes from education (in the broadest sense of the word). My father was educated in the 40s & 50s and his mental arithmetic is amazing, as is his classical knowledge. In fact, I'd be hard pushed to find an area of his education I'd consider 'worse' than mine, but there are many, many areas where it is better.

Speaking to some teachers, it appears the trend in state education is towards understanding rather than facts (I don't know this to be true, just something I have been told).

[andrewsmith]

Originally Posted by simesb

Kids are as stupid as they every were. The only thing a baby really knows is how to suckle, the rest comes from education (in the broadest sense of the word). My father was educated in the 40s & 50s and his mental arithmetic is amazing, as is his classical knowledge. In fact, I'd be hard pushed to find an area of his education I'd consider 'worse' than mine, but there are many, many areas where it is better.

Speaking to some teachers, it appears the trend in state education is towards understanding rather than facts (I don't know this to be true, just something I have been told).

I meant in the common occurrence of not being able to read at age 10 or write their name at 8. My old mans arithmetic is seriously better than mine, but I know of occurances at my old Uni of first years not knowing what 10 x10 to the power of 3.

I know what your implying and concede that is a fact of life!

Originally Posted by Dicky Ticker

Last night,helping my granddaughter with her homework I said something was "Wrong".
You do not say wrong apparently,the answer should be modified and then she goes into a speech about the three ways of correcting something.

I once saw an undergrad write-up a chemistry lab-report where the result was clearly wrong (and fiddled/cooked as well!) as "correct within an order of magnitude"