Brakes! - Train your brain! - Teaching granny to suck eggs!

[fizzwheel]

Its all been covered, so I wont elaborate any more. Just to add, if I may.

If you are reading the road correctly, you should have your speed set so that you drive the bike through and out of the corner, we should remove the need for panic braking in the first place. Also you'll be surprised just how fast you can actually corner. Many times I've thought I wasnt going to make a corner, let the brakes off turned in, leaned the bike over and then used the throttle to fire it out once the vanishing point started to do just that and got round.

Its a bit like when Yoda says to Luke Skywalker.

"Do or do not, there is no try"

I.e. if you think you are going to fall off or crash, in that situation you probably will, a bit of positive thinking never hurt anybody, best way of avoiding an accident is to not put yourself into the position of having one in the first place. But theres definately sense in practising braking techniques as -Ralph- is suggesting IMHO and when I passed my CBT my dad advised me to ride along a gravelly road and practise braking on a loose surface so I could feel what the bike was doing / how it was behaving. I also think learning to ride on off road on grass helped me alot as well. I definately noticed how much smoother I was after the moto cross off road day I did a while ago made me on tarmac. But I'm wandering off on a tangent now...

[garynortheast]

There are many ways of learning DB. One way is to read and absorb information from someone with more knowledge and experience than oneself and then go and put it into practise.
This could well be the reason that a large number of coppers and racers are such good riders. They didn't all learn to ride that well by farting about on two wheels in an unstructured fashion.

I've been on tons of rideouts and watched almost everybody go round tight corners at speed where they had no way of stopping in the distance they can see, great in theory, just isn't practical on a lot of hilly tight corners.

I've seen riders on here fly round blind corners and would have no chance of stopping if there was something immediately in their path.

I was using my satnav to read corners for me in france as it was impossible to read them normally or you'd go round them at 20 mph, i would've had no chance of stopping on some of them had something been in my path, as it happens I knew the roads generally were empty so risk was low.

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by dizzyblonde

Sooner folk up their riding standards than concentrating on flippin analysis the better. This is the thing that gets folk falling off. Too much analysis on forums,
not enough 'on your own' learning.

You're telling me thinking about what you're doing and how you do things makes you fall off? Are you mental?

I would certainly agree with the sentiment "go ride the bike" but thinking about and discussing scenarios and actions is a good thing. If people don't think then people will follow fast people, and go fast without knowing why or the logic of where it is safe to do so.

If you don't like analysis and discussion, you're in the wrong thread.

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by Teejayexc

I understand the gist of what you're saying YC, but how many, you and me, included can say they know what is around every bend ?

It's immaterial how fast, or slow, a rider takes a corner if there is something unexpected there.

Nobody knows what's round every bend. But to avoid falling off you give yourself enough safety margin to be able to account for what you don't know.

Originally Posted by dizzyblonde

gah,,,,,sorry lads, if you ride like a d1ck, yer gonna die.

Simple.

Not simple. You can ride like a d1ck if you know you're within your limits. You can also ride like a sensible Mr Buttercup and still die. You can cross the road dressed like a flourescent banana and still die

Originally Posted by dizzyblonde

This is the thing that gets folk falling off. Too much analysis on forums,
not enough 'on your own' learning.

How does it automatically equate to people falling off, are they reading from their iphones while riding? I think not. Every moment on the road is a learning curve and if remembering just one thing read on this forum helps you adjust your riding style to one safer then these threads have made the difference.

I am most fortunate to have YC, I often come home after a ride back from work or whatever with a query about riding, we natter about it and cross examine what's gone on, why I reacted the way I did, how it affected the bike, how it could have affected it, how I could have prevented/improved etc. I very much enjoy these conversations, they make me think about my riding in a way I probably wouldn't have a chance to on my own. And yes, no amount of reading can equate to experience but if you're prepared to learn and absorb the information as best you can then you can only ever improve your safety and knowledge of the road. These threads will help towards providing that, I can guarantee it. I know I have already.

[DJ123]

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

You're telling me thinking about what you're doing and how you do things makes you fall off? Are you mental?

I would certainly agree with the sentiment "go ride the bike" but thinking about and discussing scenarios and actions is a good thing. If people don't think then people will follow fast people, and go fast without knowing why or the logic of where it is safe to do so.

If you don't like analysis and discussion, you're in the wrong thread.

I agree with this. When i go out riding with my Dad, when he's going for it i can't keep up. Not for lack of power (by much) by experience and skill. Your skill level plays a huge part in how you can read, asses and attack a road. You gain this by riding on your own and with better riders, picking up hints, tips and getting pointers from them. Being able to put them into practice and gaining a benefit from them is what counts.
I also learnt a lot from reading the Police roadcraft books, a worth while read IMO. I am planning to do a days ride out with the Police force, and look into doing an IAM's course too

[fizzwheel]

Originally Posted by dizzyblonde

Sooner folk up their riding standards than concentrating on flippin analysis the better. This is the thing that gets folk falling off. Too much analysis on forums, not enough 'on your own' learning.

But how does one up ones riding standards if one does not discuss riding techniques. There are many ways of doing this, talking it through on a thread like this is just one way.

There are many others, granted, this is just one, its a valid one all the same IMHO.

[sv4me]

Originally Posted by fizzwheel

But how does one up ones riding standards if one does not discuss riding techniques.

I didn't know the Queen rode a bike

Look at this beggar, and imagine it's summer, the foliage is in full greenery, as are those three trees. You're on a sports bike, and your head is not on a big mast like the google camera, it's a bit lower than the top of that hedge in summer.

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=mark...94.99,,0,14.03

The corner itself is doable at 30mph real easy, up to 45 mph I'd say if you were pushing on a bit.

Now look at the corner from the opposite direction and imagine a tractor and trailer coming out of that field entrance and crossing to go down the little lane

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=mark...3,,0,4.58&z=15

Now go back to your view on approach, remember your eyes are at half the height of that camera!

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=mark...94.99,,0,14.03

What speed do you need to be doing to stop if that tractors half way across? You can't see it until you see past the tree stump, and you're at a lean angle when you see it.

I'll give you a clue, from the camera to the drain is about 18-20 ft.

30mph is 44 feet per second!