Helen's starter motor

[BillyC]

Just a bit ****ed off at the attitude of Suzuki and Daytona's - which is basically f&*£ you, we're not going to help unless you make all the effort.

A warranty seems to be like an insurance policy - in that they'll wriggle and squirm their way out of any responsibility in any way they can.

Dan, basically I don't have the knowledge or experience to do this job myself, let alone the tools, oil or other equipment required. It's not just the puller, but the whole environment.

Basically, this isn't one of Daytona's own, so they're not interested; and Suzuki Customer Service aren't interested, because I'm a customer, and not a dealer.

billy, Suzuki customer services are there to complain to inorder to sort out your problems, IE if daytonas arn't prepaired to work on the bike due to no good reason then they should speak to daytona's.
That being said the service history of a bike can and sometimes will be questioned when waranty claims are to be made. Its a gamble that you took when you serviced it away froma a dealership. Is it cheaper to replace the dogy parts and service it yourself or is it cheaper to get suzuki to replace the dogy parts and get a dealer to service it? well depends on the mileage you cover, for example if you do 4000miles a month then do the service yourselves if you do 4000miles a year then get a dealer to service it. In reality I dont see how your service history will affect this as the starter clutch is a replaceable part not a serviceable one and never gets touched on a service.
You know some dealers will try to help while others will try to fob you off. Its not to do with you its to do with the payment Suzuki give the dealership to do waranty work. It is substantially less than what the dealership can charge a customer so naturally no dealer wants to fill workshop time with waranty work when they could fill it with a fully chargeable customer.
Ironically the majority of faulty bikes go wrong in the summer when the workshops are busiest, in the winter when a dealer will take on anything the bikes get tucked up out of use so dont have problems.
Up to you what you do but obviously its gonna mean a few Phone calls, and I can strongly recomend a few dealers NOT to use and likewise some which work to a very high standard. but then thats one for msn I feel

Originally Posted by BillyC

Well Daytona's say they want to see service history before they'll investigate the warranty claim.

El Boc - do you know if this specific problem has been relayed to Suzuki GB?

Hey Billy,

The truth is that I don't know. But, if I were Suzuki's Parts Manager, I would know the frequency with which I had to reorder that particular part relative to model sales. And I would know if it were "high" or "low" compared to a notional "mean". I saw five faulty ones in a York dealership and I was the sixth....in a short period. Others on this site have suffered the same problem. Draw your own conclusions.

My instincts are that this is not a manufacturing fault but a design-related fault, ie, it is marginal for strength in certain circumstances.*** If that IS the case, Suzuki will not admit liability for the obvious reason of not being able to reclaim any costs from their supplier. And at a claim cost of (say) about £175, they won't want to open any doors.....

In any event, this is not a problem where they can claim service negligence - it's a non-service item - and you might be able to get an independent consultant's report to back you up. What I would have done in my days in the Industry would be to authorise a dealer to strip/examine/report, and then made a goodwill "with no admission of liability" gesture. Will Suzuki? Dunno.

As far as the task itself is concerned, it's not difficult per se. You need 8mm sockets (long), snipe-nose pliers, a couple of spanners and some allen keys. Oh, and the wretched rotor-removal bolt at £29 (which I'll gladly lend you). The worst bits are stopping the engine turning whilst you undo the rotor nut, and holding the rotor whilst you undo the six allen screws that hold the damn clutch in place. With decent tools etc, an hour - say two to allow for plastering up the knuckles occasionally!



*** I've been trying to think of the failure mode on mine: in hindsight, I was pushing it up my back passage - I'll rephrase that! I was pushing the bike along the "ginnel" leading to my back yard. I was tired and decided to have some motor assistance; hit the starter with the bike in first gear (clutch in); as I did so, I let the bike roll back about six inches and released the clutch a bit to stop it. That broke the starter clutch. It shouldn't have done and that's why I think it's design-marginal.

But then, what do I know??!!! I'm only a sandwich these days......

[BillyC]

Well... things are looking hopefull. I think Helen may have batted her telephonic eyelashes in the direction of one of the Sturdey clan in Tonbridge, and they're going to do it.

I think they indicated that it was a warranty claim, as it was a non serviceable item.

Now, we've just got to get the bike started, and get it down there!

[northwind]

Originally Posted by BillyC

If a starter-motor clutch is broken, it could have only been broken by starting the engine - not exactly unreasonable use! The point of a warranty is to get this stuff fixed, not stand around arguing about it!

Mmm... Playing devil's advocate, it could also be caused by starting the bike in gear, or I suppose by hitting the starter with the engine running. Neither are especially likely, to do the front you'd need a broken (or bypassed) clutch cutout switch or some unlikely series of events... Just thought I'd point out it's not quite that simple.

It's strange, I don't ever recall hearing about this problem before- though John Tapley had a similiar problem with his starter gear I think? I've got absolutely no idea at all where my rotor puller is- Jonboy? Burner? But if El Boc's one's not available for any reason I'll try and find out.

[Sid Squid]

Generally speaking the problem is usually either broken or weak springs - easy to fix and costs next to nothing in parts - or at higher mileages the rollers get flatted and if that happens then the drive gear hub is usually worn too, that means replacement.

Very occasionally the drive gear breaks away from the hub, but if that happened then I'd be fairly sure that the resulting horrible noises would rather concern you and thus give it away completely.

[BillyC]

Well Gents, I really don't know what's going on...

... but I do know that Helen's bike now starts


After pushing it up and down the road for 20 minutes, with me slamming my substantial **** down onto the seat and releasing the clutch, the engine didn't really want to start.

So we pushed it over the road to another street, that eventually starts going down quite a steep hill. We tried a couple more times without success as we approached the hill... and I was then able to start rolling downhill and keep trying under my own steam. Eventually, after much grumbling at being left sitting around for a week... the bike started! \/

But as I got it to the bottom of the hill... it stopped again - idle speed too low. After cursing and swearing a bit, I tried the starter out of desperation.

VROOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMM! It started first time! Confused and delighted I rode it back up to Helen and told her what happened.

The bike now starts first time on the starter button... no random spinning, just chug-chug-vroom!


So, eminent professors of the forum... what's going on? and should we worry about it, or continue in blissful ignorance?

tres bizarre!!! I'd still take it to the dealers for a once over dude

[Sid Squid]

Stuck clutch rollers.

Kinda odd that all three stuck and at the same time, but if it's working then frankly I'd leave it alone.