![]() |
#51 |
Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Rochester,Kent.
Posts: 824
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#52 | |
Member
Mega Poster
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Shropshire UK
Posts: 1,365
|
![]() Quote:
The gyroscopic effect means that the rotating wheel wants to keep rotating in the same plane and will continue to do so unless a force is applied (the rotating wheel wants to maintain status quo and keep bike upright), by turning the the front wheel relative to direction that the bike is traveling a sideways force is applied through its rolling contact patch that transfers through the CofG of moving mass which is quite a distance above the tyre contact patch, this makes the CofG move sideways and rotate the bike relative to the fixed tyre contact patch. It is mainly (non-existent as we now know) centrifugal force acting through CofG that pushes the bike over. Gyroscopic progression may play an important part initially when the axis of the gyroscope (front wheel axle) is turned, it is important because it is the quickest thing to take effect, but not the biggest force in the grand scheme.
__________________
2016 SV650 AL7 Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear - Mark Twain |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#53 |
Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: St Albans
Posts: 364
|
![]()
I disagree, the centrifugal force wants to push the bike back upright ...
The difference in the circumference between the inner and outer edge of the contact patch will cause the bike to turn in an arc. This causes a centripetal force through the contact patch, but because the centrifugal force is through the CoG, it will cause the bike to tilt back upright. But, this potential rotation is exactly balanced by the downward force due to the CoG no longer being above the contact patch - so you have gravity pulling the bike towards the road and the centrifugal force pulling it upright. Looking at it a different way, you can't lean the bike when you're not cornering and you can't corner at speed without leaning the bike. The two forces counter each other exactly. (If they weren't exact, then the bike would tilt until a new equilibrium is reached.) At speed, you can initiate a turn using the gyroscopic effects of counter-steering, or by moving your weight off the CoG, or a combination of both, but it's just the lean of the bike which determines the radius of the arc you're turning. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#54 |
Member
Mega Poster
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Whyteleafe
Posts: 3,395
|
![]()
I don't think there yet exists a full working theory of 2 wheeled bike physics. It's a bit like the three body problem where there isn't a satisfactory solution yet.
Of course that could be because it's mainly bikers who are interested in solving it and they like to disagree a lot ![]() ![]() ![]()
__________________
Silver SV650SK3, Fuel exhaust |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#55 |
Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Rochester,Kent.
Posts: 824
|
![]()
LOL!
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#56 |
Member
Mega Poster
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: JAMOADR(1999 Curvy) 39,000 miles
Posts: 1,487
|
![]()
They still aren't 100% sure how Aircraft wing aerodynamics work<grin>
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#57 |
Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: St Albans
Posts: 364
|
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#58 |
Member
Mega Poster
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Shropshire UK
Posts: 1,365
|
![]()
All I know is that if you fit the wings on upside down the plane won't leave the ground easily. But you can fly a plane upside down if you have the correct angle of attack (tail lower than front of plane).
__________________
2016 SV650 AL7 Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear - Mark Twain |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#59 |
Member
Mega Poster
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Shropshire UK
Posts: 1,365
|
![]()
Have done a bit of trawling today and found this little nugget about counter steering, complete with some videos of actual handlebar and bike movements. It's a beginners guide so even I didn't have any trouble grasping what the guy is trying to tell his readers.
http://www.obairlann.net/reaper/moto...rsteering.html
__________________
2016 SV650 AL7 Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear - Mark Twain |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#60 | |
Member
Mega Poster
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,708
|
![]() Quote:
Obviously I've generalised a whole lot with the figures there, but hopefully keeping it simple makes it easier to understand. Now you see why skinny little runts like Marquez pretty much have to climb off the bike mid corner where lardy chaps like Crutchlow just have to shift their knee.... ![]() To take the principal further this is also why you get above the bike when you are expecting or controlling a slide. Here you want to be using some of the "grip" available to hold the bike down into the corner so that when you lose this grip it wants to pick itself up (the centrifugal force) rather than low siding the tyres out from under you. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
|
|
![]() |
||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Cornering position | Bordtea | Bikes - Talk & Issues | 65 | 30-05-12 09:18 PM |
Cornering | zigrat | Bikes - Talk & Issues | 10 | 03-05-09 07:36 PM |
I'm lame at cornering in the wet | schofs | Bikes - Talk & Issues | 66 | 22-01-09 05:57 PM |
Sv Cornering | Endellion | Bikes - Talk & Issues | 67 | 18-05-07 12:39 AM |
Now cornering like I am on rails... | Shooter | Bikes - Talk & Issues | 6 | 10-04-05 12:29 PM |