OK, I have scared myself...

[flymo]

I've never crashed. I've decided to leave the bike before its finished moving a few times

Back when young people pretty much all rode bikes as essential transport, we all fell off on a fairly regular basis. It taught us quite a few things:

How to roll
How to read the road
How to repair a bike so you can still ride it home
How to put up with serious friction burns
How to laugh through the pain
How to... numerous other things.

Youngsters today have it so much easier in the pain stakes with all the armour we now have, but they need to grow a sack when it comes to this thinking about whether they should carry on riding just because they fell off a couple of times.

Ralph , mate , go and do a Bikesafe course , I found that my high anxiety about "what is around the next corner" evaporated in a day . I used to go into corners with all sorts of useless **** in my head and hardly any of it applicable to what was actually happening or needed for the situation . You don`t last long in those scenarios , you may think you are getting away with it but it`s only a matter of time . I`ve been on many rideouts and have had concerns about 2 characters and how they ride ...... and sure enough they have binned their bikes .

Anyhoo , I did a Bikesafe course and I didn`t slow down , become overly cautious , started knitting or smoking a pipe whilst wearing slippers . I became observant , relaxed and IF I feel like it and am in the right frame of mind and conditions are favourable I can hustle . Those skills learnt on that course have made riding a totally different experience , much calmer and actual fun , BUT ........ and there is a little voice inside your head that gives you warnings , LISTEN to it , it`s called instinct . If it says "I have a bad feeling about this" then back off and calm it down . That little voice is also the voice of reason and can save you from making bad decisions , I often think it`s the voice of doubt as well and as soon as it has spoken up it has jinxed the moment .

I rode through London this weekend , on a busy Saturday and right next to Finsbury Park where a massive gig was being held , those skills I learnt also applied here where I developed a defensive riding posture but relaxed , scooters were warned away without a toot of the horn and Taxi drivers were basically told to do one without me gesturing at them . Observing and then reacting in good time seemed like it took ages and monitoring those around you (hazards) to make sure they did you no harm , in reality it was a few nanoseconds but observation made things more relaxing . I did the same journey back out on Monday morning in rush hour . Now the same thing applies to countryside riding , the hazards may be different but they are there nonetheless , you can ride swiftly and still make good time but also in a manner safe to you and not be any slower than being in "Hoon" mode . I`m not saying you will become immortal , but you will certainly learn a lot and it`s a skill that you learn in a weekend that matures over the days then into weeks and months and years . Go and give it a whirl .

[dizzyblonde]

Originally Posted by -Ralph-

What about loosing the front end and going down at 10mph, whilst crossing a gravel car park. Or lowsiding a moped at 20mph on something slippy when they were 16 years old, because they didn't have the experience to read a slippy surface? Have these guys never done that? Everybody started somewhere.

Crashing is part of learning to ride a bike, which is why I find it difficult to believe someone who says they have NEVER crashed. If some experienced old guy says, "I crashed a few times when I was just starting out, but I haven't crashed for the last 40 years, then I'd believe them", but NEVER I find difficult. Maybe that rider exists, but I don't expect to come across him in my lifetime.

I did a high funny twirly spinny 10mph crash on my street, it went up in the air, then my head bounced on the floor, and I watched it slide on the crash bung round and round down the street before me. It took me four years to learn how to do this. I never want to do this again!
In the four years prior to that, I never did such a thing other than drop the damn thing. Then I pinned myself under the other SV two weeks later. No low speed crash no high side, so slides etc in all the six years apart from that one incident. I hope I carry on in such a way, I'd rather it be that way, because if I was at it every couple of months I'd be a nervous wreck!
People that never crash in such a way, are a rarity, but they do exist. I am not one of them.

Originally Posted by xXBADGERXx

Ralph , mate , go and do a Bikesafe course

Originally Posted by -Ralph-

I don't ride like that all the time, in fact a few qualified IAM instructors/riders have said I'm a safe sensible rider and my bikesafe feedback was that there was nothing constructive that they could add

All I got on my Lothian and Borders police Bikesafe course was a bollocking for giving it too many beans on an overtake, up to 75mph in a 60 limit, when there was no oncoming traffic, so I could have passed a bit slower. Less time spent alongside another vehicle on the wrong side of the road is better IMO. Otherwise the feedback was "Your riding is fine, you've obviously read up on your roadcraft, and there isn't much more I need to add."

More than one IAM instructor has told me that I wouldn't need many observed rides before doing my test.

It's a blasé attitude to risk, and not using quiet twisty 60-80mph back roads as a race track to practice cornering as hard as possible that I need to sort out, rather than my roadcraft or riding ability.

I will do IAM, there is just some personal circumstances that are preventing me from being able to settle with a single IAM group for any length of time at the moment.

I spoke to Warwickshire police about their bikesafe's and they do seem to be more in depth than the Lothian and Borders ones, so I might go and do another one.

[Mr Speirs]

I think Ralph that when you get back out on the SV you will automatically reign in your riding and leave yourself the margin of error you are looking for.

I had a similar experience after my crash.

Im glad you posted this thread Ralph, and im glad youre ok. The most positive aspect of this is that everyone reading will be assessing the way they ride and whilst some will say 'im fine' and forget it, others will take stock and maybe further crashes will be reduced.

Ive been feeling really jealous because my OH is about to exchange his sv for a full-on sports bike and theres no way I can do the same, so i've been unhappy that he'll be disappearing off round the bends leaving me behind having spent the last year learning to keep up!
But the truth is that i have responsibilities and mustn't take too many unnecessary risks and for that reason keeping my SV will be just fine. Trying to keep up with him will end in disaster for me, i dont have the experience or the natural skill to ride at that level, so I shouldnt be trying, although I do!

Ive been reading the posts here today and want to say thanks Ralph, you've made me think about the way i've been riding, with nothing in reserve, and reminded me that i need to settle down and keep safe.

I hope when all the evaluation is over you can get back on the bike, ride safe at a level you're happy with and enjoy it again xx

[G]

Originally Posted by Mr Speirs

I think Ralph that when you get back out on the SV you will automatically reign in your riding and leave yourself the margin of error you are looking for.

He hasn't the two times previous though

Binky and I both said we needed to chill out a little on the way home when we left you at that hospital near manchester...then we nailed it the whole way home along the snake pass (admiring your handy work on the way).

I keep telling myself I need to slow down as I've seen some scary stuff (your crash was an eye opener), crashed myself (not on the road admitedly) and lost 2 people in the past year. To a certain extent I have slowed down, but for me that removes some of the enjoyement.

Yes I love the social aspect of riding, meeting up with new and old people (pete ) is awsome. But part of the attraction is the buzz from going relatively quickly on some nice roads... The problem is that as time goes on, the faster I need to go to get that buzz... and sometimes it does get a bit silly.

It's a funny one with no real answer.

You will either slow down or you won't... looking at the statistics it looks like ralph will struggle to resist the speed demon inside:P

Well , if you have done bikesafe and are considering IAM then I personally think that this accident will be the key in what will change your riding from now on , just the process of doing this thread alone is the start of your acknowledgement that it needs to have a different approach .

How about just slowing down a bit?

So what if people are quick and you can keep up with them, think about your riding a bit more, assess things that are going on around you. It's very rewarding, riding progressively and thinking about things before your doing them, than aggressively and thinking after...

Go and release some 'wanting to go fast energy' on the track, admittedly, it never helped me, because I left the track and carried on riding like I was still on the track.

Sometimes, incidents make you think Ralph, it's normal mate.