User yer - bleep - indicators!

Originally Posted by petevtwin650

They are ear-piercingly loud although I don't wear earplugs so that would make a difference obviously.



Surely in London they are great for warning dozy pedestrians and cyclists.

lol..London cyclists and pedestrians don't seem to pay much attention to loud revs, let alone some beeping indicator.

[Red Herring]

Originally Posted by ophic

As Ralph pointed out, thats exactly what happens. Only they're actually going one step worse and pulling out even though there isn't a signal. If someone was signalling left, and i'd seen them start to indicate as they approach the junction, I'd take that as enough evidence that they were turning left - especially if the alternative was to sit there all day with a bunch of frustrated drivers sat right behind me.

Which is another issue entirely. If I was approaching a right hand bend with a junction on the nearside that contained a vehicle waiting to pull out, and I intended to continue around the bend I certainly would not be positioned towards the nearside kerb. Yes it may give you the best view into the bend, and potentially the fastest line around the bend, but your position and speed has to be as a result of all the information and the potential danger from the vehicle in the junction would mean you compromise your line towards the crown of the road, which would be a fairly good signal to the drivers around you of your intended route.

[ophic]

Originally Posted by Red Herring

Which is another issue entirely. If I was approaching a right hand bend with a junction on the nearside that contained a vehicle waiting to pull out, and I intended to continue around the bend I certainly would not be positioned towards the nearside kerb. Yes it may give you the best view into the bend, and potentially the fastest line around the bend, but your position and speed has to be as a result of all the information and the potential danger from the vehicle in the junction would mean you compromise your line towards the crown of the road, which would be a fairly good signal to the drivers around you of your intended route.

This assumes the road is wide enough for road position to be an issue and detectable, and also assumes that the traffic turning left would position themselves towards the nearside.

One possible advantage to positioning toward the nearside when following to the right, is that it gives you options should the waiting vehicle pull out.

[Red Herring]

Originally Posted by ophic

One possible advantage to positioning toward the nearside when following to the right, is that it gives you options should the waiting vehicle pull out.

Like this perhaps, I don't think so. Distance equals time to react.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQS6D...layer_embedded

Originally Posted by Red Herring

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQS6D...layer_embedded

ouch! As a noob to the world of riding, is there anything the biker could have done differently to perhaps avoid this situation or not?

Perhaps he should have had his eyes on the car to the end and spotted him moving out at 0.32 then hit the brakes? He couldn't have been concentrating on the car the whole time by the looks of it?

[Red Herring]

Generally a car only turns right out of a junction when nothing is coming from it's left. That's a good warning sign to you. Secondly the absence of anything coming the other way means you have an escape route. Personally as soon as I saw the car start to move I'd have been across those hatchings, not going for the brakes.

[the_lone_wolf]

Originally Posted by thulfi

ouch! As a noob to the world of riding, is there anything the biker could have done differently to perhaps avoid this situation or not?

Leave more space, not enough to tempt the car driver to nip out but enough that you are in his line of sight for plenty of time, move around in your lane to make yourself more visible but at the point where the car is emerging be right against the white line if safe to do so giving you max distance between yourself and the idiot...

I have a tiny bit of sympathy with the car driver in the video because the bike was so close to the car in front the emerging driver wouldn't have seen his RHS indicator flashing and thus wouldn't be expecting him to slow to the point where he'd clip him pulling out. Only a tiny bit mind, still 100% the driver's fault for driving into a vehicle already on the carriageway

[ophic]

Originally Posted by Red Herring

Like this perhaps, I don't think so. Distance equals time to react.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQS6D...layer_embedded

yeah exactly like that. He was well wide and still got hit. Keeping to the nearside would make you more visible to the car, and with some chance of swerving behind it - especially with earlier example of a "straight on" left turn, you'd be straightening to avoid the car - a better chance in my mind than tightening a turn in front of a car to avoid it, with the possibility of ending up in the other lane with oncoming traffic, or even being shunted there by the other driver.

Originally Posted by Red Herring

Like this perhaps, I don't think so. Distance equals time to react.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQS6D...layer_embedded

Too close to the car in front, so he compromised both his own visibility and his own obs, and those of the driver who hit him. Both rider and driver got woken from their snooze by the collision though, obs was poor on both sides, and the riders anticipation was non-existant.