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Old 17-08-18, 11:02 PM   #21
isutty5
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Default Re: Noisy Cam chain?

I've had the bike since 10k with one previous owner. Was immaculate when bought and has run without issue for 3 years.

Last year I had an oil leak which meant I ran on very low engine oil for about 100 miles. Way below the low marker.

Could this have contributed to early cam chain wear?
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Old 17-08-18, 11:33 PM   #22
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Default Re: Noisy Cam chain?

Quote:
Originally Posted by isutty5 View Post
I've had the bike since 10k with one previous owner. Was immaculate when bought and has run without issue for 3 years.

Last year I had an oil leak which meant I ran on very low engine oil for about 100 miles. Way below the low marker.

Could this have contributed to early cam chain wear?

100%

As stated I've never had an over-head cam-chain engine but if there's consistent low oil to the top-end then a chain will wear/stretch faster than a pure Over-head Camshaft direct to Push-rod operated system where there is no chain to stretch.

It's basic physics.A chain that's not getting lubed correctly whether it's at the back wheel or in an engine will wear and stretch prematurely.

I've pre-empted this on my SV as I'm a 40 year usage believer in Moly/MSo2

Not only will I never let a leak let my Motorcycles run low I protect the engines with MSo2 so that even if I miss the level the engine/s give me a chance to recover from my laxity.

And again to explain to people who do not understand the power of MSo2.

It's not a,"Friction Modifier".

It does,"Not" cause,"Clutch Slip"

It has no effect on non metallic parts such as Clutch friction plates.

It is inert and does not affect the function of the oil it's added to.

It is it's own unique compound that is used even in Dry powder form as a bearing lubricant in Ocean going liners and Supertankers drive shafts and bearing couplings that can last over a Million miles.

It adheres to points of metallic contact under high stress reducing the Mohr factor.

My 99 has 22,000 miles on it and sounds like it's not long out of the Showroom and pleasantly run-in

Stock exhaust ,

https://app.box.com/s/tzkld9wa7inm7x6lemb8hwcko9jzbxwg

With ChinaProvich slip-on.

https://app.box.com/s/50v1t40uzq6mayvxq6edm7cavzd3nxk6

Recorded on excellent cheap Chinese Android phone<grin>
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Last edited by R1ffR4ff; 17-08-18 at 11:50 PM.
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Old 17-08-18, 11:52 PM   #23
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Default Re: Noisy Cam chain?

Quote:
Originally Posted by isutty5 View Post
I've had the bike since 10k with one previous owner. Was immaculate when bought and has run without issue for 3 years.

Last year I had an oil leak which meant I ran on very low engine oil for about 100 miles. Way below the low marker.

Could this have contributed to early cam chain wear?
pretty much as i feared without asking. running an SV low on oil is a killer.

even if you do fix the cam chain the damage is done and i would guess that the big ends will start knocking at some point as well.

there is no way that a cam chain should need replacing after 38k. the SV engine is pretty bullet proof if serviced properly but there are two things that will kill them, the first is wheeling long distances and the second is low oil levels.

believe me, dont believe me, its up to you.

there is no additives that can replace worn/missing metal.
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Old 18-08-18, 08:11 AM   #24
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Default Re: Noisy Cam chain?

Again I agree with Bib.

However I know getting an oil test is popular in the US.I've never had one done but found these people,

http://www.theoillab.co.uk

http://www.theoillab.co.uk/product-c...esting/engine/

They have different price range tests so I wouldn't know which was best.If you are thinking of repairing the engine it might be worth getting one done.
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Old 18-08-18, 09:46 AM   #25
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Default Re: Noisy Cam chain?

Quote:
Originally Posted by R1ffR4ff View Post

I've pre-empted this on my SV as I'm a 40 year usage believer in Moly/MSo2

Not only will I never let a leak let my Motorcycles run low I protect the engines with MSo2 so that even if I miss the level the engine/s give me a chance to recover from my laxity.

And again to explain to people who do not understand the power of MSo2.

It's not a,"Friction Modifier".

It does,"Not" cause,"Clutch Slip"

It has no effect on non metallic parts such as Clutch friction plates.

It is inert and does not affect the function of the oil it's added to.

It is it's own unique compound that is used even in Dry powder form as a bearing lubricant in Ocean going liners and Supertankers drive shafts and bearing couplings that can last over a Million miles.

It adheres to points of metallic contact under high stress reducing the Mohr factor.

My 99 has 22,000 miles on it and sounds like it's not long out of the Showroom and pleasantly run-in
+ 100%

I am also a long time user of Moly in engines and gearboxes (and even the lawnmower when I have a bit left over) - engines in all my cars have done very large mileages and not used a drop of oil or had a spanner on them (except cambelts in older cars).

MsO2 is the reason CV joints now last the lifetime of the car and don't need replacing every 50K or so. MsO2 is a boundary lubricant, which means it is still there on bearing surfaces when you first start your engine before the oil gets woken up and is there if the oil goes away - as R1ffR4ff says it sticks to metal (the disulphide bit has an affinity to metals) and forms a film of molybdenum plates that have extremely low sliding friction. I add 2% (60ml) to my motorbike engine oil.

It is widely used in industry in very challenging lubrication applications, many years ago my next door neighbour was a lubrication engineer, they used to sell dry film molybdenum lube to power stations for use on the chains of conveyors that fed pulverised coal into the boiler furnaces, it was the only thing that was effective, I blagged a few cans off him and used it on my motorbike and pushbike chains

https://www.threebond.co.jp/en/techn...pdf/tech09.pdf


https://www.machinerylubrication.com...ilm-lubricants
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Old 18-08-18, 12:13 PM   #26
isutty5
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Default Re: Noisy Cam chain?

Well I've taken it to Bolton motorcycle workshop today and the mechanic is 100% certain it's cam chain.

I'm gonna get this fixed. cost around £500 incl labour.

Then I'll be adding liqui-moly to my oil from now on.

From that point I can only hope she'll be good from there.

Listened to a video on YouTube of worn big end bearing and it's a distinct knocking sound which I do not hear any of on my sv.

So big end bearings obviously not an issue at this stage. (Not denying I think some wear may have occurred when oil level low)

At the end of the day, my sv650 runs as good as it always has if you ignore the sound of the cam chains. I have no performance issues whatsoever.

I just have to remain positive and hope all will be good once cam chains sorted.
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Old 18-08-18, 01:42 PM   #27
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Default Re: Noisy Cam chain?

Quote:
Originally Posted by isutty5 View Post

Then I'll be adding liqui-moly to my oil from now on.
The 2% mixed with oil by volume for bikes with wet clutch is the max recommended on the LiquMoly website. As previous post I use 60ml (20ml per litre) in my AL7.
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Old 20-08-18, 04:22 PM   #28
yorkie_chris
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Default Re: Noisy Cam chain?

Don't just go start putting random formulations (a lot of which are snake oils) in your oil before actually fixing the fault.

Running your oil low did not wear your cam chain out, no bloody way. The chains are lubed from general splash from the valve gear IIRC. If this oil flow had been reduced, at all, it meant your oil pump was sucking air. This would have destroyed the big ends way before the cam chains.

IMO the cam chain fault is a rare manufacturing defect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SV650rules View Post
many years ago my next door neighbour was a lubrication engineer, they used to sell dry film molybdenum lube to power stations for use on the chains of conveyors that fed pulverised coal into the boiler furnaces, it was the only thing that was effective, I blagged a few cans off him and used it on my motorbike and pushbike chains
Main reason being as a dry film, it isn't sticky.
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Old 20-08-18, 04:26 PM   #29
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Default Re: Noisy Cam chain?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seeker View Post
How much different is it because the curvy one looks similar:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRsAEhhkUZ0

I can't find a picture of the pointy tensioner (and I'm curious).
It is function of it. Curvy tensioner has a threaded bar down the middle, pointy one has a ratchet pawl.

Curvy one you need to rotate it round to slacken it off, pointy one you take the spring out then reset it
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Old 06-09-18, 10:58 AM   #30
isutty5
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Default Re: Noisy Cam chain?

Quick update:

She's back!!! And holy **** she's like new! New cam chain. Old one was stretched way beyond limits and even skipped two teeth! valve clearances adjusted as exhaust way too tight.

The likely cause of premature wear: The mechanic stated the throttle bodies we're so out of sync he's never seen anything like it. Due to additional load on the rear cylinder, timing was under stress and thus causing wear on the chain.

new air filter which was full of **** and new fluids. I honestly have never seen her run so well. She purrs and grunts like she always should have. Fuel economy improved, more power and smoother power delivery. Mechanic said she was close to total death.

I count myself lucky she didn't bend her valves.

Most important lesson learned: if you have a feeling she used to run better, don't assume it's just age. Get her serviced and properly checked. Keep throttle bodies synced up!

Sorted

Last edited by isutty5; 06-09-18 at 06:09 PM.
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