Legal to push a sorn bike?

Originally Posted by Owenski

Another fine "fact v's opinion" thread brought to you by SV650.org in association with "sounds about right.com"

All facts are opinions but not all opinions are facts.

[ryanh1418]

I think the question's been well and truly answered by now! In order to push a vehicle on a road you will need to be fully documented as far as insurance and tax etc goes. In all honesty even that probably isn't an issue in the real world - just technically. But definitely don't ride it as some are, hopefully tongue in cheek, suggesting.

It gets complicated when you talk about driving for the purposes of licence/disqualification issues and accidents but, as someone else has already said, should be a mix of the law and common sense. I can't find a specific case law relating to someone being stuck on for pushing a mcycle whilst disqualified /unlicenced suggesting it hasn't happened - it has for cars and just to make that shade of grey a bit more murky England and Scotland disagree!

I think the case law most relevant is r v macdonagh 1974. It relates to a disqual driver pushing a car on a road (having been instructed to move it by a PC!)
It opens with " The Road Traffic Acts do not define the word 'drive' and in its simplest meaning it refers to a person using the driver's controls for the purpose of directing the movement of the vehicle. It matters not that the vehicle is not moving under its own power, or driven by the force of gravity, or even that it is being pushed by other well-wishers. The essence of driving is the use of the driver's controls in order to direct the movement, however that movement is produced."

But Lord Judge whoever then went on to declare the defendant not guilty! His counterpart in Scotland disagreed and found his defendant guilty.

So make of that what you will.

To my mind that explains why this thread has reached three pages and will no doubt continue. But I'm leaving it there; I've got the weekend off, the wife's away and the pub's open!

what about if you put it on a trolley and pushed it on that? hahaha

i do have a trolley big and strong enough for a bike!

Originally Posted by ryanh1418

I think the case law most relevant is r v macdonagh 1974. It relates to a disqual driver pushing a car on a road (having been instructed to move it by a PC!)
It opens with " The Road Traffic Acts do not define the word 'drive' and in its simplest meaning it refers to a person using the driver's controls for the purpose of directing the movement of the vehicle. It matters not that the vehicle is not moving under its own power, or driven by the force of gravity, or even that it is being pushed by other well-wishers. The essence of driving is the use of the driver's controls in order to direct the movement, however that movement is produced."

But Lord Judge whoever then went on to declare the defendant not guilty! His counterpart in Scotland disagreed and found his defendant guilty.

So make of that what you will

Many Thanks

BTW - If he was instructed to move it by a PC, who reported him for the offence??

Originally Posted by Spank86

All facts are opinions but not all opinions are facts.

Eh?

Originally Posted by monkey

Eh?

I could have qualified that by saying all facts as we experience them.

They are filtered through our perceptions and as such are our single or group opinions on how reality is.

Everything starts with basic assumptions, we just try to make those assumptions as small as possible.

I could have an opinion that Madeline McCann's parents know what happened to her, but that's not a proven fact.

That Levi Bellfield murdered Milly Dowler is accepted as a fact, but actually it's only the opinion of a judge and jury.

All facts are opinions but not all opinions are facts.

So this fact: the moon is smaller than the Earth is in fact someone's opinion?

No I don't get it.

Facts are facts.

Sorry to derail op.

Originally Posted by monkey

So this fact: the moon is smaller than the Earth is in fact someone's opinion?

Yes, it relies on your perception and way of looking at the universe, its just difficult to accept that because we only HAVE our perception.

Dont get me wrong, its very close to being objective, hard 100% known fact but nothing ever can be.