Anyone use Michelin power one tyres (road/track)? and other questions

I'm considering getting some race take off tyres for trackdays. I've got a couple of contacts who have a load of Michelin Power One's in V, A, B and C compounds.

Would I be able to get them to a useable temp in slow inters? (bearing in mind they are road legal)

What sort of mileage/amount of time on track should I expect from the different compounds?

How much do the compounds differ and would I appreciate the difference? (Using Diablo Rosso's at the moment)

Will they expire with heat cycles? (Again bearing in mind they're road legal)

Finally what is the shelf life of tyres?

Thanks.

[lukemillar]

Originally Posted by monkey

I'm considering getting some race take off tyres for trackdays. I've got a couple of contacts who have a load of Michelin Power One's in V, A, B and C compounds.

Would I be able to get them to a useable temp in slow inters? (bearing in mind they are road legal)

Yes

Originally Posted by monkey

What sort of mileage/amount of time on track should I expect from the different compounds?

I have the popular soft front/medium rear combo (albeit Pirelli). So far they have 2 race weekends and half a practice day on them. I was thinking of getting 1 more trackday out of them and then changing. I'm sure you can get more, but it depends on how much you push them and how much of a performance loss you are willing to take. And of course how much spare $$ you have

Originally Posted by monkey

How much do the compounds differ and would I appreciate the difference? (Using Diablo Rosso's at the moment)

Not sure on this one. I get the feeeling that most club racers/trackdayers stick with one setup. At $600-700 a set, you don't really want risk trying stuff out in case it's ****! People stick with what they know

Originally Posted by monkey

Will they expire with heat cycles? (Again bearing in mind they're road legal)

I know that the compound supercorsas are tetchy about heat cycles. A friend in Sydney used to run Metzeler Racetecs instead as they were more 'heatcycle friendly' as he didn't have warmers and used to ride to the track.

Originally Posted by monkey

Thanks.

You're welcome

Have these been out for a while in the UK? We only just got them.

Are you going to run them with tyre warmers?

Thanks Luke.

No tyre warmers I'm afraid. I'd love to go down that route but it'd be far too costly for me as I haven't even got transport.

I'm getting some spare wheels so I can use these race take offs from the triumph triple challenge. I've got someone who can regularly supply and the fella selling me the wheels has a load too, all of which have done one race. I can get them for around £40 a pair.

Surely if they're road legal tyres they won't drop off too much in the performance stakes from heat cycles?

I found that I got 5 trackdays from my first pair of Diablo Rosso's (good road/ocasional trackdays) before the tyre went lopsided and felt horrible to use. On my latest pair I done one trackday in blistering heat and that made them lopsided again. Strangely enough after the second they feel a bit more normal.

What would you suggest I do? I don't want to pay £200 or so for tyres I won't use on the road but for them to last the same or a little bit onger than these take offs.

[lukemillar]

Originally Posted by monkey

Thanks Luke.

No tyre warmers I'm afraid. I'd love to go down that route but it'd be far too costly for me as I haven't even got transport.

I'm getting some spare wheels so I can use these race take offs from the triumph triple challenge. I've got someone who can regularly supply and the fella selling me the wheels has a load too, all of which have done one race. I can get them for around £40 a pair.

Surely if they're road legal tyres they won't drop off too much in the performance stakes from heat cycles?

I found that I got 5 trackdays from my first pair of Diablo Rosso's (good road/ocasional trackdays) before the tyre went lopsided and felt horrible to use. On my latest pair I done one trackday in blistering heat and that made them lopsided again. Strangely enough after the second they feel a bit more normal.

What would you suggest I do? I don't want to pay £200 or so for tyres I won't use on the road but for them to last the same or a little bit onger than these take offs.

Road legal is a bit of a misnomer. It's to do with the land/sea ratio which makes a tyre road legal, rather than it's useability/longevity on the road.

If you have spare rims, and go for the race take-offs at 40 quid a set! Bear in mind 1 race will probably be the equivalent to 1-2 trackday seesions in the fast group, so I'd imagine for someone who isn't pushing the absoluite limits, you'll get a lot more out of them

Hairy muff. I'm just thinking that the amount of heat cycles a road tyre gets is mahoosive compared to track/race tyres.

Go on Luke give me a guesstimation of how many days I should get out of them? Slow inters. I've read loads of conflicting stuff on the net tonight about heat cycles.

It's not really about getting the ultimate grip for me but lessening the ods of an off or even giving me a little more cahoona's. I've done a good few successful days now with no problems, the last being Cadwell the other day which was fantastic!

[lukemillar]

Originally Posted by monkey

Hairy muff. I'm just thinking that the amount of heat cycles a road tyre gets is mahoosive compared to track/race tyres.

That is true. I don't really know the definitive answer regarding the heatcycles I'm afraid - just what I have heard through word of mouth which I always take with a pinch of salt.

I do think the reason it's hard to say is because the difference in pace is so massive that what is correct for one rider, is way off for another. I think number of heatcycles/number of trackdays/races totally depends on how quick you are and how much a few tenths for a sec a lap from new tyres vs. worn tyres means to you.

I would say that you could expect to get 2-4 trackdays out of a set of part worns depending on the track (good mix of rights and lefts) at that pace. Be interesting to see what others say about the heatcycle thing. I know Weazelz used to run race supercorsas without warmers.

Unless you are a the cutting edge of racing and need to get an extra 10th of a second a lap out of the bike, don't worry about heat cycles.

I've used Racetecs, Supercorsa pro's and loads of other sticky stuff on the road (and track) in summer and winter and its never been an issue. You can do knee down peg scratching, stop for a cuppa and get on and warm them up again and repeat many many times and you'll not notice the difference. I use race scrubs on the road and they are ridiculously sticky despite several hundred heat cycles (literally).

You *will* notice the difference between a hot and cold tyre in terms of handling and grip but not the difference heat cycling makes.

Heat cycling reduces overall grip slightly but you telling the difference in 1 degree of lean before the tyre starts to tell you it's not happy as they age isn't going to spoil your day.

For slow inters Racetecs at slightly higher pressures than the fast boys use, offer good cold grip and great hot grip. run them about 33/35 cold and adjust from there. I've found Racetecs have better cold grip than SC pros and Dunlops. race scrubs should cost you about £25 each. Not tried the Power Ones yet but I'd be happy doing a track day on Pilot Powers so these will be stickier. Any of the compounds will offer a large grip reserve if you are in the slow inters.

All three of the above are carp in the wet and any Sports touring tyre would be better.

How many track days will you get from them depends entirely on your right hand. Go hard, wear more. Two track days on a race take off is good going especially if the take off was from the same direction track as you will be on. I just about finished a new GP Racer on Monday at Knockhill in one day but that was open pit lane and you spend a lot more time on track. At the day in the summer I did on the Hornet at Leeming, I finished a race take off SC pro in 130 miles. (5 advanced sessions)

If you get more than three track days out of a set of tyres then you're not trying hard enough

C

I've now ordered some Power Ones for the Mallory Track day on the 28th. I'll be able to do a back to back test of Dunlop GP Racers, Racetecs and Power ones on the same day (if it's not persisting down!) I've also got some Michelin Intermediates to see how they compare too.

Please be dry! I don't want to use the wets!!

C

Thanks for your responses Berlin. Hope the Michelin's work for you. Unfortunately I think I'm going to have to wait until next year to try mine.

Hoping for good weather for you.

Well, I finally had a chance to use the Power Ones in anger at Cadwell Open Pit lane with yorkie Chris yesterday and I have to say I'm impressed.

The day started on full wets due to a damp, but drying track but the tyres were soom changed to the Michelins.

I was using the V profile front and a medium rear. they were up to temp in tyre warmers quite quickly, certainly quicker than Dunlops and Racetecs. I headed out for two relatively slow laps to make sure they were well up to temp in the cool but sunny conditions.

The tyres were very predictable all the way around until the right hander part of Goosneck where it gave a slide under power.
This happened again at the same bend later in the day but this time under engine braking at the same spot. It shows that its important to warm both sides of this tyre up on the Power Ones. One side is a different compound to the other and this differential cooling is mentioned in the promo blurb.

If I was racing on them, I'd have to say I'd be hesitant into the first corner if there'd been a significant wait in the holding area or on the grid after the warm up lap.

Once up to temperature, they were simply awsome! I was riding pretty much as fast as the cold conditions would allow me to (others were going a lot faster) after 4 laps and was putting in laps of Cadwell of around 1.53-1.55 with an air temp of about 3-4 degrees. Not once did the tyres complain. I was riding past the point where the dunlops would have been sliding out of corners and also past the point where racetecs would have started to complain.

The V section front was superb and really allowed some serious loading!

The fact that I didn't find the limits all day (bar the two cold slides) could mean that its a knife edge when they do! There were lots (as in over a dozen) of fallers yesterday and a guy on a triumph 675 totalled his bike on Power ones so he obviously found the limits somewhere. Most of the fallers were on racetecs but that could have been because most people were on racetecs. Some Diablo Super Corsa riders also went down.

And now the interesting bit. A little un-nervingly I ran the rear at the recommended 21 psi cold and it was superb. Two warm up laps and it never slip once. It didn't tear up and remained in good, if scrubbed condition all day. It also didn't seem to wear signficantly all day.

Looking at the (extremely good) photographs of the event last might I was at a measured lean angle of 57 degrees on them! (see photo section)

So overall I'm impressed but will be testing them directly against Diablo Supercorsas and Racetecs at East Fortune and Croft in the next few weeks on timed laps to see how they get on. The only downside was those two slides on the cold side of the tyre which I recon wouldn't have happened on the racetecs.

C