Carbon Fibre Wheels. Insane project.

OK, to cut a long story short, I love riding fast and hard but modern sportsbikes (of both 600 and the crazy litrebike class) with their typically IL4 motors make it FAR too easy to find myself the far side of the ton on any short straight between corners. Now cornering is what motorcycling is all about for me, but being a MotoGP fan, I want a bike that looks like a sportsbike, not a supermoto (other obvious solution to the problem) or a naked streetfighter thing (*really* not my style).

As a new poster, I'm bound to get the **** ripped and the truism that the throttle turns both ways… and I'm expecting a mild flame roasting But I seem to have a red mist generator in my lid - buy a new lid, and by the time I get it home the red mist generator has installed itself

So pretty much the ENTIRE UK market of sportsbikes had to be written off - I don't weigh much, and a nice lightweight CBR600RR with me on would be, ridden 'enthusiastically', too easy to end up way over the ton on straights between corners. I'm no riding God - nowhere near - but whilst I can handle losing my licence, I can't handle jail. I run a business and I'd lose my entire life if I was sent to jail for 110+ speeds, which has happened.

A bike that thrashes hard from 0 to 100 (ahem, 70, occifer) but doesn't disguise speed well, doesn't feel smooth and comfortable above 100, and makes 60 mph feel *fast* and exciting is what I want. After trying to make a Ninja 250 do this (don't bother, but you *can* ride your favourite twisty road in 6th with the throttle pinned and *never* change gear or brake), I swapped for an SV650S and I'm in love.

Yes, it's a 10 yr old curvy model, 24k miles on the clock, different tyres front and rear, front suspension clonky and utter rubbish, and initially-worrying front brakes (these have got better as I've ridden it harder). It's a black bike, other than the duff mismatched tyres and other maintenance items, a standard UK model. Not even a messed-about end can.

It's been used as a commuter, obviously, and the engine and box are sweet enough (for a V-twin... my first bike was a Monster 600 so I love 'em). However strong the engine is (and it feels strong), the rest of the bike is quite clearly tired.

Since my project means NO MORE POWER but much better handling and lighter weight, I came across BST carbon wheels. Ace, I'll have some of them. But they don't make them for SV650s. OK, a small setback.

However they DO make them for any combination of GSX-R made since the mid 90s. So... do people put GSX-R parts on their SV650s???


Oh yeah, they do... after finding these forums... I've decided that I've struck gold. Not only is the bike perfect, the power output perfect, the engine configuration perfect, but the crap bits can be swapped for proper sportsbike bits (as opposed to unadjustable budget commuter bits) and I can then slap on some carbon wheels and have a *slightly* lighter bike that should be a twisty road monster.

And all along the way, I can learn how to maintain and fix a bike. I've got tools and loads of enthusiasm, plus plenty of *theory* but little *practical* experience (never had a house with a garage, main reason). Still don't have a house with a garage but I now have a flat bit of tarmac in front of my house, two decent paddock stands and the ability to pop the bike up in the air for working on.


So (apologies for the long post) - what I'm aiming for is a 5.50" width rear wheel from a GSX-R of some sort (as that is replaceable with a carbon one) - will it fit the swingarm? Search time...
But a lot more importantly, I need to swap the entire front end, ball-race clonky wiggly forks and all, for GSX-R forks (preferably USD forks) with a GSX-R front wheel (which can be replaced with a carbon wheel).

There are some nice tutorials on swapping USD GSX-R forks onto pointy SVs but not the curvy ones. Is this a no-go (i.e. do I need to swap my curvy SV650S for a pointy one) or can it be done with a bunch of tools, some enthusiasm, some money, and a helpful bloke with lots of experience?

Apologies if someone has done this and photo-documented it here... in which case BIG apologies - I did do a search first but only got the newer pointy SVs. And, you know, it'd be a laugh to bolt wheels that cost more than the bike to a 10 year old tatty SV650S... and FWIW I actually like the look of the curvy bike more (so again apologies if that puts me in the 'bad guy' group).

At the end of the day, I reckon a black 10 yr old SV650S with shiny USD forks, black carbon wheels, new, properly set up suspension, new brakes, but the old engine and limited power would ride *brilliantly*. Great round the bends, fast between them, but no silly top speed. I'm not trying to do this on the cheap so advice would be greatly appreciated.

Cheeeers in advance!!!

[yorkie_chris]

Yeah, new GSXR stuff will go on.

You right anyway, curvy ones do look better. Not sure they look like a sportsbike though!

You bothered about steering lock?

For me, with your budget I would go for K4/5 GSXR 600/750 front end entire, revalve it and the carbon wheel for the same model should fit.

For the rear, no question, use penske. 8983 is brilliant, 8987 a little better (not sure how much, as I have not tried mine yet).
For your rear wheel, late model GSXR stuff may work. However the SV uses a quite narrow chain offset. You need to reduce the offset from the GSXR. The problem you will probably run into is the fancy aftermarket stuff does not have any meat on it (hence so light!) so you can't just hog material off to line the chain up.

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

Yeah, new GSXR stuff will go on.

You right anyway, curvy ones do look better. Not sure they look like a sportsbike though!

You bothered about steering lock?

For me, with your budget I would go for K4/5 GSXR 600/750 front end entire, revalve it and the carbon wheel for the same model should fit.

For the rear, no question, use penske. 8983 is brilliant, 8987 a little better (not sure how much, as I have not tried mine yet).
For your rear wheel, late model GSXR stuff may work. However the SV uses a quite narrow chain offset. You need to reduce the offset from the GSXR. The problem you will probably run into is the fancy aftermarket stuff does not have any meat on it (hence so light!) so you can't just hog material off to line the chain up.

Ta for the response - I've been searching and there's tons of stuff to use so thanks for the lack of 'do a search you moron'. It's just scattered everywhere and some of the bits I want to do have threads devoted to the pointy bike when mine is a curvy.

Basically, I want to put USD forks on the front for better handling, hopefully with nice taper roller bearings and not the junk that's currently making my front end feel 'clunky' and prone to its-going-to-start-slapping when touching a bump or ridge mid-corner when leant over.

First jobs are being done already - consistent sticky tyres (I like Bridgestone BT-003RS as I had them on my Ninja 250 and they transformed the bike), and a new rear spring and damper. I've already ordered a Nitron mid-range (2-way adjustable, set up for my weight before delivery, made and set up very locally to me so very convenient if I need a rebuild / adjustment made) remote reservoir damper, which is competitively priced. I don't know if this is as good as your Penske recommendation, but I'm making the assumption here that *any* known brand damper unit will be adequate given that the performance of the complete bike will be MUCH higher than my talent and ability. If the Penske is 10% better than the Nitron when I let Lorenzo borrow my bike then it's not going to be a big deal for me Also, Nitron dampers are well-regarded in the Lotus car world, from which I've come back to bikes from (I drive an Exige S PP as my trackday toy, haven't got the balls to take bikes on track yet, though am getting the itch)…


The rear damper / spring and tyres should be done in the next couple of weeks. Thanks for the K4/5 recommendation - got millions of different combos now! Is this a straightforward swap i.e. use forks, brakes, wheel, yokes from GSX-R and think about bar ends later, or will kits / machining of yokes be required (is there a thread already on this?). There's a thread on GSX-R750 K7 USD forks onto a curvy… looks lovely but has snags - is this something I'm really going to need to consider taking the bike to a specialist to do? If the K4/5 you recommend is similar to the K7 then yeah, I'm up for that (the K7 pics looked fantastic)...

It sounds like there's an easy front end (600 SRAD?) swap I can do myself, resulting in 10 yr old RWU forks from a GSX-R. I know I should be focusing on performance rather than looks, but looks drive me to wanting to swap to a more recent USD fork set front end, which looks to be a lot harder on a curvy SV. Also, I know GSX-R riders (and have been castigated for calling them 'gixxers' too, heh), some are quite, politely, nutty and I'm not so sure that a 10 yr old set of GSX-R forks are going to be in great condition. So really I'd like to use newer replacement forks, this gives me the 'look' of USD (and the performance, unsprung weight being even smaller esp. with carbon wheel) and the likelihood that a set from a breaker will be in good, low mileage condition. I'm assuming here that the best bet will be to buy a guaranteed-straight complete front end from a breaker - buying the parts from Suzuki would be idiotically expensive, right?


I'm happy getting a specialist to help me out - but they've got to be local… I live in NW Kent. I want to do some of the work myself to learn about it all (rather than yet another cheque-book project) but don't want to touch safety-related stuff (brakes, for example) myself…

If it turns out there's a race shop that does MiniTwins within 20 miles of me then I'd be better off contacting them about the project, no? After all, the suspension change and rear wheel swap is pretty common by the looks of things.

Regarding your first question - yeah, I'll want *some* sort of steering lock because I also commute on it! I don't really consider the current bike to have much in the way of steering lock though… However I *so* want steering lockstops to prevent the tank damage shown in one of the other threads from someone who dropped the bike with a converted front end with no stops. Or the possibility of tankslappers smashing my fingers to bits, of course

And the curvy with side fairings looks pretty sportsbike-like to me! Well, I reckon anyway. Shame to cover the lovely frame piping though… that's last on the project plan of course

[yorkie_chris]

You can get steering stops from a guy on TWF racing forum.

You could use SRAD yokes, which are 50/54 to keep your steering lock working exactly as OE. Ask northwind on here about all the spacings and such you need. I think discs may need spacing out or something if you put radial forks in.

SRAD stuff is fine, but benefits a lot from a revalve. Later stuff is much closer to right to start with.

Minitwins shop will be no good for you, minitwins you need to use stock forks, brakes, wheels!

How long is nitron shock?

[andrewsmith]

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

Yeah, new GSXR stuff will go on.

You right anyway, curvy ones do look better. Not sure they look like a sportsbike though!

You bothered about steering lock?

For me, with your budget I would go for K4/5 GSXR 600/750 front end entire, revalve it and the carbon wheel for the same model should fit.

For the rear, no question, use penske. 8983 is brilliant, 8987 a little better (not sure how much, as I have not tried mine yet).
For your rear wheel, late model GSXR stuff may work. However the SV uses a quite narrow chain offset. You need to reduce the offset from the GSXR. The problem you will probably run into is the fancy aftermarket stuff does not have any meat on it (hence so light!) so you can't just hog material off to line the chain up.

The gsxr swap will do wonders and gives more set up.
YC i think the penske's about £600 and £800 respectively on the cash grounds and any other shock is an improvement over the 1 installed (mines v. interesting over bumpy road and humpback bridges)

I would consider putting a thread into the racing section on the rims and see what others have done. There maybe a thread lurking in there on the Thundersport bike that been recently finished with a bonkers spec

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by andrewsmith

YC i think the penske's about £600 and £800 respectively on the cash

£657 2 way, £765 for 3 way.

[andrewsmith]

thought it was something like that! Wished i had reddies for a sh*t hot shock
zx 636 shock it is

and this is the thread for the special http://forums.sv650.org/showthread.php?t=148072

****. OK then I'm now stuck in a hell of a quandary - do I continue in my 'do as much myself, learn how to wield my spanners and torque wrenches with some degree of skill, enjoying the build as much as the final product' mind-set…. or phone up the Surrey chap who built the special in the other thread and do yet another cheque book project?

I'm not looking for an insane spec like that. When I said 'insane project' in the title it really related to the idea of bolting £2600 wheels onto a bike that I paid £2100 for - all my mates have said 'you silly ****' and pointed at their nice shiny supersport 600s and litre bikes. But I don't want that - I don't want to go faster than 100 when hooning *enthusiastically* on UK twisty roads - I want to corner fast, not go fast in a straight line on motorways giving fast cars the finger. Not my style, and the SV with its limited power and low-down torque delivery is an absolutely BRILLIANT starting point, now I've finally bought one after messing around with other bikes.

In fact the engine will remain bog standard apart from maybe *anything* that will improve reliability given its all-weather life (no garage) - so maybe some rain protection for the electrics, spark plugs apparently vulnerable? I want to swap the end can purely on weight grounds (I'm a Lotus driver - see the link - I'm not after power, I'm after light weight) but I think it is classed as a 'performance modification' and really troubles my insurance (I'm 35 though and will be 36 when the project gets in full swing). Oddly twice the value of the bike in carbon wheels doesn't increase the risk as much as 2-3 more bhp, but that's the twisted logic of insurance companies for you.

I'm happy with the power as it is. Don't need more, I don't have the skill for stunting yet so don't need to be able to pull wheelies off the throttle in 3rd (I'd buy a litre bike if that was the project goal). What I *want* is to be able to lay it down and bomb round any given corner as fast, if not faster, than the 600 supersport bikes.

I'll need to look at ground clearance and almost certainly swap pegs (that may force an exhaust swap) but the SV650 is so narrow that it *should* make an *awesome* cornering bike.

Currently, mine saps confidence due to 10-yr old head bearings, sloppy forks, different tyres front and back and the fact it *wiggles* like buggery if cornering with reasonable lean angle (not necessarily fast - just leant over a bit) on non-smooth surfaces. I'm guessing this is all suspension and sorting *this* rather than messing around with the engine will make me *much* faster, no?


ETA: Nitron damper/spring/remote reservoir unit, valved / set up for my weight and with all fittings etc. required for the SV (exact model, mine is SV650S yr 2000) - cost me £499.37 all in (that's including VAT, delivery, setup, etc. - all I paid). Will take 2-3 weeks for build and delivery. The unit is the second model in the three-model range, the third model being a race unit far in excess of what I'd be able to take advantage of. Dampers are built and valved for your weight and bike type, and general riding requirements (mostly track, track / road, mostly road, fast road, commuting, pillion, etc.). I thought that was a good deal myself. The remote reservoir is a hose-type job on the SV damper, it's a piggyback job for other bikes, depending on space in the frame. Performance is meant to be the same. Check the HPS website for more, I dealt with a chap called Ben Hunter who has been MORE than helpful - it's where I'm going to get the carbon wheels from...

[yorkie_chris]

An end can adds bugger all power TBH. Less than the 5% increase they care about.

Fit rearsets IMO. GBmoto make good ones for reasonable price.

I don't think carbon wheels will make you any faster.

with a curvy, full system exhaust, dyno jet, ignition advancer, quick action throttle, what few ponies you've got, you want them right there when needed... and use the naked gearing

for suspension i went with front racetech springs and emulators with a bitubo rear shock

brakes, ebc pro lites, std calipers, hh pads, braided lines all round, std pads for rear next time methinks

i also used titanium caliper, disc and axle pinch bolts

i turned a sow's ear into a really nice pigskin pouch, silk purse money would have been craaaazy