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Old 02-11-17, 01:43 PM   #31
keith_d
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Default Re: Catalonia

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Originally Posted by Talking Heads View Post

Like Brexit, the No vote was won on a raft of false promises.
All of three independence votes (Scotland, Brexit, and Catalonia) had the same major deficiency - no real facts about what would happen after the vote. Both sides just made assumptions which suited their position, without any basis in fact, then tried to convince voters to buy into their fiction with an emotive appeal.

Unfortunately, that seems to be the nature of politics at the moment. Too much showbiz and not enough analysis.

Last edited by keith_d; 02-11-17 at 01:45 PM.
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Old 02-11-17, 01:48 PM   #32
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Default Re: Catalonia

bit off topic...

why do we have political parties? would it not be better to have constituency candidates who people vote for and the winners make up the Gov. same goes for all the leading positions like the chancellor and the prime minister.
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Old 02-11-17, 02:09 PM   #33
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Default Re: Catalonia

Australia fines people who don't vote. They also have preference system where you vote for your preferred candidate, but also vote for your second preferred candidate and maybe third preference as well. If nobodies first preference gets a majority then the candidate with least votes gets eliminated and the second preference of the people who voted for failed candidate is added up and so on until someone gets over 50% of votes.

It does mean that candidate who wins had over 50% of people's votes, even if they were second or third preference votes.
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Old 03-11-17, 08:56 AM   #34
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Default Re: Catalonia

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Australia fines people who don't vote.
I'd be happy with that idea providing there was a box on the ballot paper that said, "I wouldn't trust any of these tosspots to organise a party in a brewery"
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Old 03-11-17, 09:06 AM   #35
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Default Re: Catalonia

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bit off topic...

why do we have political parties? would it not be better to have constituency candidates who people vote for and the winners make up the Gov. same goes for all the leading positions like the chancellor and the prime minister.
With one or two exceptions, independent candidates regularly get stuffed by the organised parties.

Labour and Conservatives can turn up in marginal consistencies with a battle bus stuffed with well known MPs to push their message, spend thousands on TV and poster campaigns, and have their activists knocking on doors. There's not much an independent candidate can do to compete with them.
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Old 03-11-17, 10:44 AM   #36
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Default Re: Catalonia

Can anyone explain what the actual point was?

Ok they held a referendum and declared independence. Now they have direct rule from Madrid, the autonomy is suspended, the people that were running Catalonia are accused of rebellion.

They gained nothing and lost, well, almost everything. Sounds like a sh!t deal.
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Old 03-11-17, 10:54 AM   #37
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Default Re: Catalonia

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Can anyone explain what the actual point was?

Ok they held a referendum and declared independence. Now they have direct rule from Madrid, the autonomy is suspended, the people that were running Catalonia are accused of rebellion.

They gained nothing and lost, well, almost everything. Sounds like a sh!t deal.
For direct rule from Madrid read 'direct rule from Brussels', the great and good leaders in EU have instructed Madrid every step of the way, they don't want any other regions / countries getting ideas about messing with EU 1000 year masterplan for a European federal superstate without borders and devoid of any national identity, like putting all the separate countries into a blender and ending up with a bland homogeneous gloop that does not taste of anything.
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Last edited by SV650rules; 04-11-17 at 08:15 AM.
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Old 03-11-17, 11:05 AM   #38
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Default Re: Catalonia

So what was the plan? Hold a (illegal/not binding) referendum with a 40% turn out and hope Madrid/EU will say "ok, on you go on your own"?
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Old 03-11-17, 11:33 AM   #39
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Default Re: Catalonia

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So what was the plan? Hold a (illegal/not binding) referendum with a 40% turn out and hope Madrid/EU will say "ok, on you go on your own"?
Probably justification for any further steps they might decide to make.

ie "we tried it the peaceful way and you didn't listen"
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Old 03-11-17, 02:00 PM   #40
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Default Re: Catalonia

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Originally Posted by Bibio View Post
bit off topic...

why do we have political parties? would it not be better to have constituency candidates who people vote for and the winners make up the Gov. same goes for all the leading positions like the chancellor and the prime minister.


I would say because there wouldn't be any sort of majority rule and things would just fall apart after a while with bickering and infighting.... which is where having a hung parliament CAN (but not always) be so bad, but sometimes these things end up being a good thing.
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