Dutch style roundabout

[Seeker]

https://www.visordown.com/news/indus...%99re-confused

basically there's an outer ring for cyclists, motor vehicles must yield on entry or exit of the roundabout if there's a cyclist on the ring.

In a quiet, low traffic area I can see it working well but in a high traffic density area I predict chaos if there are many cyclists on the ring. How will it integrate with roundabouts that have traffic lights installed?

Cyclists are supposed to navigate the roundabout clockwise but what happens when they want the exit that's on their immediate right, will they follow the rules?

I'd sooner they spent the £2.4 million on improving road surfaces.

[Kenzie]

I think its dangerous and should not be rolled out. People barely pay attention on roundabouts as it is, and to also have to give way on the exit too will lead to a lot of shunts.

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[SV650rules]

Giving way on a roundabout exit wtf.... mind you there are a lot of cyclists in Holland / Netherlands (whatever it is called nowadays ) so they have to do something - cycling must be easy because the whole country is so flat....

[Bibio]

i was asked on my bike training/test why i was looking over my left shoulder when turning into streets on the left. my answer was 'looking for cyclists and running pedestrians'.


good luck Cambridge and i hope they have a good bone ward in their hospital. when are we going to get a Gov that makes people responsible for their actions.

[SV650rules]

I make a habit of looking is LH mirror in the car / over shoulder on bike when turning left off islands - especially the smaller 'fantasy islands' where people queuing to get on and the roads are all close to each other, some people try to sneak on inside you even when you are signalling left..... There have been swarms ( should that be plagues ) of cyclists out and about during lockdown and apparently pushbike sales have gone through the roof - many garages will have cobweb covered bikes in them when this virus thing is over...

Originally Posted by Bibio

when are we going to get a Gov that makes people responsible for their actions.

The modern way is to make everyone a victim - personal responsibility seems to have no part in their nanny state plans.

[Luckypants]

The big difference between here and The Netherlands is the law makes an assumption of guilt by the driver of a vehicle involved in a collision with cyclists and pedestrians. So over there cyclists can sail out willy-nilly onto their special bike roundabout "safe" in the knowledge that car drivers have been forced to look out for cyclists and slam all on if they see one. You cannot take a road design developed in another country and plonk it down in another country with very different driving styles, cycle use and laws - then expect it to work.

Here in Britain, cyclists are viewed much differently and the rule of the road is those exiting a roundabout have right of way unless something or someone is already in the road. Not only will there be many shunts caused by folks stopping for oblivious cyclists but also lots of said cyclists being mown down by those who don't (or won't) stop for them.

[Ruffy]

A number of issues spring to mind but the missing detail here is what happens on the distant approaches to the roundabout, i.e. what's the straight road infrastructure away from the junction. If there's not a decent separate cycle path along all the roads then no experienced cyclist is going to hop off the main carriageway onto the new circulatory bit and then have to give way back into traffic after they've taken their exit, they'll just keep going on the road. Even more so if it's quite a busy junction.

I actually think this is a poor solution done on the cheap. Yes, not enough money spent (compared to 'traditional' design)! What's the actual problem trying to be solved by this? If the concept is to separate cyclists from other road traffic then a grade-separated junction is required to do it properly (i.e using bridges or underpases).

I agree that better surfaced conventional junction would have been better use of the funds (albeit with widened throats to allow for cycle traffic).

Policymakers need to clearly decide whether cyclists (& horses for that matter) are to be categorised as non-road traffic or as low-speed road vehicles for the purposes of highway design and then set the rules on prioritisation accordingly.

Personally, as a regular-ish cyclist (as well as motorcyclist & car driver of course) I'd prefer simpler road designs that treat bikes as part of the road flow. I'm a road user - in urban areas I'm much closer to car speed than pedestrian speed when on my pushbike. This junction design feels like a bit of a mess, an example of a committee coming up with a poor overall solution - compromise in every areas to avoid having to deal with serious conflict with any one stakeholder group.

[ethariel]

Luckily that takes a lot of space to drop in so we won't be seeing many, if any in London, however I hope they have a lot of insurance in place for the claims from both sides for the accidents that abomination will cause and a plan for the increased pollution as cars sit and wait and wait and wait as peds cross slowly 1 at a time lol

[keith_d]

As has already been mentioned, this design works in Holland because the rules are different and motorists are expecting people to stop for cyclists. I've not worked over there for a while, but when I did there was a lot less traffic which makes quite a difference.

I've heard it argued that the dutch cycle more because they have more cycle paths and traffic laws to make cycling safer. But I think people have actually got that backwards. For the dutch, riding bicycles is as much a part of their culture as the italians riding scooters. Their town planners have been forced to accomodate this.

So, trying to just plonk a dutch roundabout in the middle of UK traffic with different rules and expectations is a crazy idea.

Just my thoughts,

Keith.

[SV650rules]

Originally Posted by keith_d

I've heard it argued that the dutch cycle more because they have more cycle paths and traffic laws to make cycling safer. But I think people have actually got that backwards. For the dutch, riding bicycles is as much a part of their culture as the italians riding scooters. Their town planners have been forced to accomodate this.

.

The Dutch ride bicycles for several reasons..
1. The Germans destroyed all their other transport.
2. Holland is the flattest country on earth, some of it even below sea level.
3. They have no indigenous fuel supply....

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23587916