Re: ARTNW Picture Thread
 

Yeah but this is an sv site, and riding on you're own is totally differant to a group.

Re: ARTNW Picture Thread
 

But the one who is special rides a Triumph Sprint 1050, not an SV. I've ridden with the .org on my Versys before now and will again soon. In the past I've ridden in a group of 10 for 400 miles at a time in one day, we didn't find it particularly difficult.

This kind of long distance in one day isn't new to me. For 18 months I was seeing a woman who lived in Larkhall just outside Glasgow - at the time I lived in Flitwick, between Bedford and Luton. Every other weekend I'd ride up for the weekend on Friday after work, then ride home again on Sunday after a good weekend of being 'intimate'. Total round trip, including a rideout on Saturday was usually about 900 to 950 miles on the two ZZR1100s I had while I was seeing her.

I suppose I don't find it difficult to do those sort of miles because I'm not a big bloke who's wrapped around his bike, and I'm quite used to working very long days with lots of driving. My last van was on the road for 22 weeks and I sent it back with 26,000 miles on the clock. My typical working day started at 0530hrs when I got in the van at home and went on through lunch to 1930 or 2000hrs when I got home. Thankfully those days are now behind me.

Re: ARTNW Picture Thread
 

Interesting debate.

Having thought about it, I'm not fast enough to lead. In fact I'm not fast enough to TEC:smt082

Hope the link works - is a map of the route

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps/ms?hl=...e7593f5ecd&z=9

Re: ARTNW Picture Thread
 

Not fast enough to lead !!!. surely it's up to the leader to set the pace at the front and as you said at the briefing it wasn't a race to the finish, at the back when I was TEC I was doing anything up to 90ish at times cos of the traffic, junctions etc. If people aren't prepared to go at the leaders pace then rideouts in a largeish group perhaps are not for them. Give them a map of where to meet and let them get on with it!. Perhaps towards the end the pace was a little slow but I would imagine that tiredness and the fact you are not on the most comfortable bike for distances played a big part. It wasn't helped by the fact we were over an hour late setting off and then people hadn't fuelled up in time and another stop for fuel had to be made in Ellesmere. taking the wrong turn was unfortunate but it could happen to anyone, everyone has done it at some time. People then decided to take their own route to Machyllyneth and we got split up, but all found Aberdovey and had a rather late Lunch, Why did people then decide to turn left at the bridge when you had gone right I don't know but it left markers not knowing what to do, if you are on a rideout you follow the leader wether you agree with the route or not, it's just rude and inconsiderate not to and leads to confusion. As you said at the beginning the pace would not be too fast due to the number and the differing abilities but some obviously chose to ignore the fact and have intimated thet the pace was too slow, fine, find a route, campsite, spend ages making sure all is in place and organise it yourselves in future.:D

Daryl.

P.S. I was thinking of organising a ride later in the year, poss from Wem again as the campsite seemed to get a big thumbs up, and going to Aberdovey again by a more direct route and then doing the part of the route back we missed, but I don't know if I would want to lead due to some of the comments.

Re: ARTNW Picture Thread
 

Perhaps it wasnt a race to the finish, but getting round the whole route would have been nice.

Thats not fair, I and many others, there been to a few "bigger" ride outs, and the pace has never been stupidly fast, at the AR10 there were no complaints about pace and there were in excess of 100 bikes there.

Surely that defeats the purpose of a group ride out.


[-X

No we didnt, the plan at that point was to follow SV4ME who had satnav because we'd got lost/taken the wrong turn. We got split up because Ed found a junction for his original route and decided to turn there. If the plan had changed to follow the person with satnav everyone should have done that, not turned at that junction. I know this because I was following the boys with the satnav, when I didnt see any bikes from our ride out behind me for ages and ages I stopped thinking there may have been an off, I turned back to find you all sitting at a junction, where we then turned off. This resulted in the people who had been following the satnav sitting marking junctions for ages, waiting on a group that was never going to arrive.

Yes - by this time it was 3:30 and it had taken 5 hours to do 100 miles. People were hot, tired and hacked off.

No it didn't, Ed's TEC knew who had split off, so once the TEC was through the junction you moved off, everyone knew who was TEC for Ed.

It may come across to some as me sounding really ungrateful - I'm not I had a fantastic weekend - but I will admit being disappointed in the ride-out. Several people were very vocal about it in the evening following the ride-out, so while I may be the only one brave (stupid) enough to say anything here I know I am not alone in my sentiments.

Ed did a sterling job finding the camp site and organising everything, even the sunshine, no-one is trying to say any different. When we were given maps of the route in the morning we all knew it was going to be a great day.

For me - I rode a huge distance to attend the ride-out I was somewhat disappointed that we didnt get to do the whole route. I appreciate how difficult it would be to lead a group, the worry and so on, and no-one here is trying to say it would be easy.

There were sections of that ride-out that were simply too slow, and dangerously slow in some parts - other said that as well, it is not just me.

*I'm going to put my shovel away now...*

Re: ARTNW Picture Thread
 

Organising and leading group rideouts is a mammoth task, and it takes some experience and practice. On things like the AR all the most experienced people on the forum come together, using proven methodologies, putting in a lot of effort, several recce rides, etc, to make sure everything holds together. There are a lot of variables and things that can transpire to split the group up. I can't count how many rideouts I've been on that have fallen apart, and twice it has happened on rideouts that I was leading. You learn from the experience, and it takes a few of your rideouts to fall apart on you before you get it right.

On the first GM we were overwhelmed by the response and the number of bikes that turned up. We knew we had a lot of names on the list, but we honestly thought that half of them would drop out in the last week or not turn up. We were using the drop off system which is what we had always used successfully on SV Ecosse rideouts, not the 'second man' drop off system, but Scotland is less densely populated, roads are quieter and a rideout of the same length generally goes through fewer towns and through fewer major junctions. Half way through the GM1 ride we had to revert to the marker system, and a few of us spend much of the rideout on the wrong side of the road at 3 figure speeds, making our way back up to the front.

I had never been to an AR before last year as it was always a long journey from Scotland for a weekend, so until I moved down here and started doing Madlanders and Border Patrol rideouts, I had never ridden with the second man drop off system, and I didn't like it, because you've just worked your way back up to a position in the group where you are with other similar paced riders, then you have to mark a junction and it sticks you straight at the back again. You spend the whole rideout waiting for opportunities to overtake slower riders. I soon realised though, that down here with the increased density of towns, roads and traffic, second man is necessary to hold rideouts together, a simple drop off where each rider marks the junction for the rider behind then moves on, doesn't work, you need static markers and a TEC.

Re: ARTNW Picture Thread
 

Personally, for me static or specific markers who then have to hoon through the pack to get to the front of the ride-out is potentially dangerous. It's dangerous for them, and for other riders. And if you want to be really picky about it 3 figure speeds are illegal and irresponsible on a ride out of that size.

The AR10 was my first experience of that system, and it scared the beejeesus out of me.


This is true, and is one of the disadvantages of the second man drop off. I am usually more than happy to mark a junction and then give myself plenty of clear road to catch up. (Sometimes I even make the TEC come back for me...eh Quiff!) I dont mind that, but it is very much a personal preference.

I know my preferred choice of marker system is second man drop off, and it worked very well on Ed's ride out and the GM that I did.

Re: ARTNW Picture Thread
 

I don't like it either, it's very dangerous IMO. On GM1 is wasn't planned to do it, but we had to revert to it to stop it falling apart. 'Drop off only' relies on every person remembering to mark every junction, and very early on it became clear that wasn't happening.

Re: ARTNW Picture Thread
 

I will just say again we had a fantastic weekend, Rach met some great friendly people and she can't wait for AR, i enjoyed finiding new roads (not through my own choice), hey tommy! :P

Not everyone made it to Aberdovey as we ended up stranded inbetween the two groups not being sure where everyone had gone. Myself and tommyh waited about 30 minutes with no sign of anyone before turning back to try and get fuel in Machllyneth, am i complaining though, no as it made no difference to my day. I also accidently overtook ED early on, but it was not on purpose or because i wanted to go hooning it off or so on. I think ed's words were "oh it's fine i just didn't want you to miss the next turn".
I agree with pretty much most of what Fenjer has written, and would definetly go again Whether ED, Daryl or the Man on The Moon organised it.

I don't think there should be much more contreversy written about this, if thats what you want to call it. And cheers again for everyones company and Ed's organisation to get everything together, Cheers Matt.

Re: ARTNW Picture Thread
 

Actually, there was. Stretchie was criticised for being too slow on a couple of occasions and he was doing so because he was trying to cut the markers some slack.