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Re: so she obviously deserved it...

I heard this on 5live last night at work and couldnt beleive what I was hearing, it seems that in something like 14 cases women have only been entitled to 75% of the compensation they would have entitled to if they had been sober, look at it the other way it means the the rapist is only 75% guilty, and with the low result in successful rape cases anyway, well makes you think....

Re: so she obviously deserved it...

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoulKiss (Post 1592256)

What I am saying is that if you do not do EVERYTHING you can to minimise what can happen to you, then you are are contributing to the situation.

this is the crux of what i was trying to say, but you put it better:D

Re: so she obviously deserved it...

Not sure cutting "compensation" can be linked to blame. If the argument was that an offender got a reduced sentence due to their victim being drunk that would be different.

That said, if you can knock points off for being under the influence you ought to be able to do the same for any general stupidity and as that isn't enforceable why just pick on drinking.

Re: so she obviously deserved it...

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_lone_wolf (Post 1592253)

you go out specifically to get drunk?:confused:

no i've never said that..

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_lone_wold (Post 1592253)

i never said the act of raped was caused by someone being drunk, although you must surely be able to see how being completely rat-arsed makes you a likely target for someone looking out for a victim and reduces your ability to defend yourself?

no, i specifically said in my previous post that there is no excuse for raping someone, but if you make yourself vunerable through your own irresponsible actions you might not like it but you should accept the consequences of your own stupidity

as previously said I understand where you are going with the whole getting drunk puts you in a vunerable position .. but your last paragraph here is bit confusing on the one hand your saying there isnt an excuse for rape but then on the other your saying that you should accept it if it happens and it's because of your own actions .. well rape isnt your choice???

Re: so she obviously deserved it...

Quote:

Originally Posted by embee (Post 1592265)

Putting aside any particular offence, do you think the concept of contributory negligence has any place in a justice system?

this wasn't about justice though, the guy was found guilty and sentenced accordingly, this was about compensation, which is something different

Re: so she obviously deserved it...

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoulKiss (Post 1592256)

Walking the streets of London, alone, as a female, while having had a drink is the same as getting on your bike wearing speedos and a pair of flip-flops.

I understand your point of view I dont agree with it but I see what you are saying. My point is that once upon a time it was deemed that women brought it on themselves because of the provocative clothes they wore and now it seems that it's also because of alcohol consumtion.

Re: so she obviously deserved it...

the bloke who raped her might have been drunk

Re: so she obviously deserved it...

'What I am saying is that if you do not do EVERYTHING you can to minimise what can happen to you, then you are are contributing to the situation.' - SK quote

Bollox, I completely disagree.

I was shocked when I heard that the woman had had her compo cut because she'd been drinking. So what if she was pished, that does not contribute to a rape.

Re: so she obviously deserved it...

Quote:

Originally Posted by embee (Post 1592265)

Maybe I still hang on to some archaic concept of personal responsibility, but I recognise there's a real world out there and no-one ever said it was fair..........

Tricky one. I left my garage unlocked whilst on holiday once. Very very stupid on my part. Certainly negligent. Had it of been robbed, I'd still want the thief to be prosecuted the same as if they'd cropped the lock. At the same time, I'd not expect to receive as much payout from the insurer, if any. So, I suppose my POV is that the victim's foolishness shouldn't effect the custodial sentence being given out, but in terms of compensation recieved, perhaps.

On the (understandably touchy) subject of rape, if someone is heavily drunk- we're not talking one or two drinks chatty here- they are much less able to put up any sort of resistance. It in no way excuses the perpetrator of the offence, but I can imagine that there are a lot of people who would never rape someone 'by force' with the person kicking or screaming, yet at the same time would certainly consider 'taking advantage' of someone who was more than a bit worse for wear and probably not even think of this as 'rape' as such. I'm not talking passed out unconcious on the floor, but you know the sort of drunk- hardly able to talk, not coherent, still standing but swaying about, can't remember much the next day. Being like this doesn't make the victim responsible for it, but the sad truth is that it could often have been avoided had they been sober in the first place.

Re: so she obviously deserved it...

and then there's the angle of crying rape when in fact she was too pished to realise she consented....

but thats getting way off the initial subject....