Greatest ever motorbike!?

Ahhh right, never knew that My dad told me tanks will run on anything pretty much. Whisky?

Originally Posted by Biker Biggles

Kerosene----diesel-----same

I thought kerosene was slightly more refined parafin.

[Biker Biggles]

Yes, not exactly the same but different grades or quality of the same stuff.
A bit like petrol comes in different ratings.

Katana Oh yeah baby

Originally Posted by Peter Henry

I think rather than the Z1 which was truly awesome in it's day. The Honda 750-4 was the real envelope pusher and was really the daddy of so many bikes on the road today. Without the Honda, kawasaki would not have had something to improve on and might have come out with a complete bag of sh*te.

mmmmm....well, if Honda hadn't chickened out by putting only one camshaft in, it might have been ground-breaking. But they didn't. Kawasaki went DOHC, and as a result, outperformed and eventually outsold the CB750. If you look at most hi-performance bikes of the 70s (dragsters, speed record machines etc) they were nearly all Z1-based - not many CBs I think. The Z1 really was the performance machine that could be bought.....until Suzuki weighed in that is, and maybe the Katana has a big claim here, for altering the shape of bikes.

As for the Zenith, although I prostrate myself before Sid Squid's knowledge, I think this would have seen it off.....

[Sid Squid]

Originally Posted by Peter Henry

I think rather than the Z1 which was truly awesome in it's day. The Honda 750-4 was the real envelope pusher and was really the daddy of so many bikes on the road today. Without the Honda, kawasaki would not have had something to improve on and might have come out with a complete bag of sh*te.

Not quite, Kawasaki were working on their 4 cylinder project, famously coded 'New York Steak', at the same time as Honda, Kawasaki's bike was also to be a 750, but when Honda relesed the CB750 Kawasaki decided to increase the capacity in order to out-do Honda.

Originally Posted by El Boccadillo

mmmmm....well, if Honda hadn't chickened out by putting only one camshaft in, it might have been ground-breaking. But they didn't. Kawasaki went DOHC, and as a result, outperformed and eventually outsold the CB750. If you look at most hi-performance bikes of the 70s (dragsters, speed record machines etc) they were nearly all Z1-based - not many CBs I think. The Z1 really was the performance machine that could be bought...

Well I rather doubt that either Honda or Kawasaki had dragsters in mind when constructing either the CB or the Z9, as such when you consider that the original design outputs and engine speeds of the two motors were well within the capability of a SOHC motor, Kawasaki could reasonably be suspected of showboating by building a DOHC motor. It made power it's true, but then it was 150cc bigger...But that's by the by really, the first big 4 that both made good power and went round corners was the GS1000, and that motor was dragged and enduranced at least as much as the Zed.

Originally Posted by El Boccadillo

Until Suzuki weighed in that is, and maybe the Katana has a big claim here, for altering the shape of bikes.

Well I hate to disagree again, for, as much as I love the Kat, it really wasn't anything special technically, it's just a styling job on a GSX1100, and looking at it, though it is undeniably fine, what's really different? Only the fairing. The seat's in the same place, so are the side panels, (ask yer dad), it has a double cradle, twin shock chassis, really nothing ground breaking at all. Does look smart though,

Originally Posted by El Boccadillo

As for the Zenith, although I prostrate myself before Sid Squid's knowledge, I think this would have seen it off.....

That particular Spagforth is at least 15 years later than the Zenith, and as good as it was in it's time, it wasn't the the leap forward that the Zenith was in it's.

I can only really agree with you, Sid - and I'd conveniently forgotten New York Streak's genesis.



But cut me some slack in the case of the Spagforth which was, it is alleged, "borrowed" one piece at a time from Brough and therefore started its life many years earlier than its final appearance suggests (it may even have been the inspiration for the famous Johnny Cash song.......).

[Biker Biggles]

My 2p worth on the Jap fours debate.I'm a Kwak supporter for the reasons given(dohc big bore ruled endurance racing)and I would concede the suzuki was a move forward.But the Suzuki was a direct development of Kawasaki's engine,indeed it has been suggested they nicked the design and just beefed it up.The real next development was the GPZ 900,but thats another arguement.
BTW my greatest bike of all is the Duke 916 and family.I could'nt live with one though,too unreliable