This weeks mcn-Kevin Ash column

So what exactly is his solution in the example above then? sit at the lights watching your mirrors so that you a) dont notice the lights go green, which COULD lead to someone rear ending you OR b) notice the muppet about to rear end you, run the light and get taken out by a bus....hhmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, I still blame the blind sod that hit you!

What a nobber!

What he is saying is that if you take the law/insurance co view of things you are pretty much a dead man.

E.g. at a give way sign a car should stop and not pull out into your path on a main road.

Legally they would be in the wrong if they pulled out. So if you assume they won't pull out because it would be wrong and illegal for them to do so then you are pretty much signing your own death sentence.

He is basically saying that drivers are too incompetent for you to assume that they will abide by the most basic laws of the road. You therefore have to take responsibility yourself.

E.g. if you take someone who is retarded and with an IQ of 20 and you give them a gun. Whose fault is it if they shoot you? You can't expect a half wit to handle something that dangerous so you would be at fault.

If you sit at a set of lights and aren't looking at your mirrors with the bike in gear and your clutch and throttle hand ready then who is to blame when the retard in the car behind goes into you? Legally they are too blame and that will never change. However as they are completely incapable you should have taken all precautions necessary. Granted there will be times when there is nothing you can do to avoid it.

I think you have all misinterpreted it. He is merely suggesting that you approach riding on the roads with a certain viewpoint of not assuming any one else can abide by the rules so it is your responsibility to avoid them.

ermm how many can move off in the .5 secs you have BEFORE that car hits you? because thats about how long i had to react-and id been checking my mirrors!

Originally Posted by Toypop

What he is saying is that if you take the law/insurance co view of things you are pretty much a dead man.

E.g. at a give way sign a car should stop and not pull out into your path on a main road.

Legally they would be in the wrong if they pulled out. So if you assume they won't pull out because it would be wrong and illegal for them to do so then you are pretty much signing your own death sentence.

He is basically saying that drivers are too incompetent for you to assume that they will abide by the most basic laws of the road. You therefore have to take responsibility yourself.

E.g. if you take someone who is retarded and with an IQ of 20 and you give them a gun. Whose fault is it if they shoot you? You can't expect a half wit to handle something that dangerous so you would be at fault.

If you sit at a set of lights and aren't looking at your mirrors with the bike in gear and your clutch and throttle hand ready then who is to blame when the retard in the car behind goes into you? Legally they are too blame and that will never change. However as they are completely incapable you should have taken all precautions necessary. Granted there will be times when there is nothing you can do to avoid it.

I think you have all misinterpreted it. He is merely suggesting that you approach riding on the roads with a certain viewpoint of not assuming any one else can abide by the rules so it is your responsibility to avoid them.

I read it like this also. It is a very poor (poss wrong) example he has used to try and put across the theory of defensive riding. He has propably made it contraversial just to get people talking about it.

As an example, when I stop at lights, I always check my mirrors, and even if I dont need to be sat on my brakes, if I see a car approaching behind me, I will dab them on and off just to give the driver another chance to see them, as he is probably a knob! No saying he will notice but it is doing a little of the thinking for the chimp in the car

Originally Posted by Paws

ermm how many can move off in the .5 secs you have BEFORE that car hits you? because thats about how long i had to react-and id been checking my mirrors!

Some accidents are unavoidable

But dont most of us ride defensivley?? and also try and second guess what that muppet car driver is gonna do?

Originally Posted by Toypop

What he is saying is that if you take the law/insurance co view of things you are pretty much a dead man.

E.g. at a give way sign a car should stop and not pull out into your path on a main road.

Legally they would be in the wrong if they pulled out. So if you assume they won't pull out because it would be wrong and illegal for them to do so then you are pretty much signing your own death sentence.

He is basically saying that drivers are too incompetent for you to assume that they will abide by the most basic laws of the road. You therefore have to take responsibility yourself.

E.g. if you take someone who is retarded and with an IQ of 20 and you give them a gun. Whose fault is it if they shoot you? You can't expect a half wit to handle something that dangerous so you would be at fault.

If you sit at a set of lights and aren't looking at your mirrors with the bike in gear and your clutch and throttle hand ready then who is to blame when the retard in the car behind goes into you? Legally they are too blame and that will never change. However as they are completely incapable you should have taken all precautions necessary. Granted there will be times when there is nothing you can do to avoid it.

I think you have all misinterpreted it. He is merely suggesting that you approach riding on the roads with a certain viewpoint of not assuming any one else can abide by the rules so it is your responsibility to avoid them.

Apart from the fact they have a licence which 'proves' they are quite capable of driving. When I come up to a red light, If I am first and there is no immediate vehicle behind me, I'll stop a couple of feet short of the line until there is a vehicle behind me. Then I'll move up to the line.

Originally Posted by Tomcat

Some accidents are unavoidable

Ah but not according to Mr Kevin Ash they arent (well thats how it seems hes put it to me)-and my hand aches from typing so much now lol

Originally Posted by Paws

But dont most of us ride defensivley?? and also try and second guess what that muppet car driver is gonna do?

yep, but I think he is trying to suggest that not ALL of us do. He is not pointing his finger at you or me, but making a sweeping statement that will offend people to get them to think about the way THEY ride

Originally Posted by BigApe

Apart from the fact they have a licence which 'proves' they are quite capable of driving. When I come up to a red light, If I am first and there is no immediate vehicle behind me, I'll stop a couple of feet short of the line until there is a vehicle behind me. Then I'll move up to the line.

See here we have red light jump cameras-you cross that white line and its 3 points and a £60 fine iirc so you cant move one inch foward or yout get fined and points.