Public Sector Pay Cuts

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by eviltwin

Forget any of your other points but, if you compare Tony Blair's influence on the party to the CP, you've massively misunderstood events within the Labour movement for at least the last 27 years.

You're right. I know nothing of it except for my own very limited experience as I alluded to in my previous post.

However, the internal politics of the labour party are a fair distance outside of my sphere of interest. So, address the other points...


My experience is of muppets who couldn't organise a p*ss up in a brewery and if they worked for me they'd be on the bus home by breakfast time.

[maviczap]

Originally Posted by Ed

Having reread this thread I have come to the following conclusion.

Those who don't work in the public sector really have no idea what they are talking about.

+1 This is my last post in this thread

Originally Posted by Biker Biggles

The worst of it is that the cuts will be "managed"(mismanaged?)by the same old corrupt desk jockeys that already run the show,and they will not be quick to cut their own cushy number jobs.So the hard working useful contributers will be the first to go.

That is one of the biggest problems with the public sector, they seem to promote and put people in charge who are at best useless leaving the workers to carry out their strange ideas...so much money and time is wasted.

Originally Posted by maviczap

+1 This is my last post in this thread

+1, and mine. If I say anything more I will get too annoyed by all the uninformed claptrap.

Originally Posted by timwilky

there is no relationship, We work for our living, public sector take from us. Yes you are going to argue that you pay tax too. So what, you still get to keep the vast majority of our money.

Yes, I know most people do a damm fine job. But Messie, ask yourself how many teachers have been sacked for incompetence? The public sector allows the shirkers to hide amongst the workers.

I would question every position created in the public service over the past 15 years, why does that job exist? and what happens if nobody was to do it.

A good example in my book is would anyone miss the road safety partnerships most districts seem to run? Except the people who are payed by them.

Working in a public sector org and having considerable dealings with others, I have to agree with this to some extent.

I'm surrounded by some really hard-working talented people. But there are also some pee-takers.

Take our admin. She's peed off with her boss for doing actually nothing - he just asked her really nicely to stop loudly huffing & banging stuff on her desk when she's annoyed, as it disturbs others. So (by her own admission) she's getting back at him by getting the doc to sign her off with depression. He knows she's taking the pee, so does everyone else. And she's got a long-standing record for pee-taking elsewhere in the org previously. But we can't get rid of her, we have to jump through hoops and follow the rule to the letter and then maybe in 6 mths, maybe we might be able to get her out...

There are some decent senior managers, but there are also several who like the cushy role, and really underperform. Not that that doesn't happen in private sector too, but they don't hang around blighting the organisation for the next 20 yrs...

My org isn't as bad as some. But I 100% support cuts, as I hate the waste. I can nominate whole sections which quite honestly we could really do without. And I'm constantly talking people out of wasting money on things.

However I worry that these cuts are too much too soon, and with the knock-on impact on the private sector will send things back into recession.

And as others have said, it doesn't always take out the problem people, and inevitably ends up squeezing the good uns even harder in terms of money and workloads.

You want to save money? Then start with changing the way that money gets handed out. At the mo, if you don't spend all your budget in the year, it's considered a bad thing, and you lose it the next. So people spend it on half baked stuff in the last quarter. WTF????

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

So, address the other points...

I'm not certain I can.

I'm unsure of where to find evidence that government funded projects cost 20x more that private equivalents.

As for government not playing a role in an economic cycle, I just can't get my head around that concept so you've got me there. What would government do? How would taxes be collected and any services purchased and provided?

If your opinion of all public servants that you've come into contact with is that they're overpaid idiots who couldn't organise a **** up in a brewery, I guess any effort to address the point would be wasted. I'm sure any teachers, nurses, soldiers, police, town planners, councillors etc reading this thread won't find that at all offensive.

Congratulations on obtaining your degree, by the way. No doubt, won through grit and determination, battling all the way against any state interference in the guise of a nationwide educational structure, expertise or funding.

Originally Posted by Fizzy Fish

You want to save money? Then start with changing the way that money gets handed out. At the mo, if you don't spend all your budget in the year, it's considered a bad thing, and you lose it the next. So people spend it on half baked stuff in the last quarter. WTF????

Thats absolutely true, my wife works in the NHS and there is always a scramble to spend if there is money left prior to the budget date, that isnt that often i guess though cos they keep getting screwed on everything.
Staying on the NHS, the amount of money that gets wasted on over inflated drug supplies is shocking.
The pharmacutical companies charge way over the odds for stuff, you know they have rediculous expense accounts as they pay for conferences in hot sunny exotic places, they pay for food and drinks at xmas parties etc, the list is endless.
You wanna see the company cars they drive.

The managers think its great cos they get to go on jollies, sorry conferences, but ultimately its the NHS that pays, which means we pay for it.
We need more value for money, not cuts.
The wifes department needs new equipment as its all obselete and they cant be repaired, but they cant get funding for them.


Slightly diferent, there is always a hive of activity around march time with the council doing projects / repairs etc, use or lose it mindset.
So things get done just to use the money up when they are not really needed.
I cant mention too much of some of the scams i know about (i havent took part in btw) council building materials being delivered to managers homes which are being extended, its all stuff WE are paying for.

Big changes need to happen in all areas imo.

[Biker Biggles]

Incidently many of the attacks made against the public sector concerning waste poor leadership and corrupt management are equally valid in the private sector.And when private sector executives start helping themselves they do it in grand style.Look at the bankers.

Why the interest in what anyone else earns?

Constant whinging and scrutinising every penny paid to employees just ultimately reduces the wages everyone takes home. Perfect for governments wanting to make huge cuts, but it just creates a stagnant economy where nobody has any disposable income other than the born-rich.

Look at Japan. Directors of Banks on £50k. We don't want that either ...

[punyXpress]

Originally Posted by Ed

Having reread this thread I have come to the following conclusion.

Those who don't work in the public sector really have no idea what they are talking about.

One thing I DO know is that WE are ( over ) paying for it: look at the way Council Tax and its predecessors have rocketed year-on-year.
Oh: and they halved the bin collections a couple of years ago.
In the last cetury we lost our Empire - until noe government, central and local have been putting more effort into building their own little empires than doing their day jobs.