Where's Blue?

Blimey, so much to quote & respond to...

Originally Posted by stewie

Personally I feel sorry for Fizz, none of the other mods ever have to publicly explain their actions.....

+1

Originally Posted by fizzwheel

The only thing thats changed is that we've done something about people who break the rules and take the p*ss.

I disagree there, more on this in a minute.

Originally Posted by fizzwheel

I think the only way we're going to sort this out is to leave this thread open so everybody can have their say, otherwise there going to keep cropping up.

+1. That was my thought before when threads were being locked for various reasons. Let people get it out of their system.

Originally Posted by dirtydog

Why should people expect flamings, assualts and verbal insults? Light hearted banter is completely different!

There's always one that opens the door isn't there DD? I personally saw Blue's threads as banter (granted some didn't). I don't remember seeing any direct insults/flaming in those threads - but equally, I haven't searched either.

Originally Posted by SoulKiss

From what I have read, both have decided to walk - but I am not a mod.

I sincerely hope not.

Originally Posted by Messie

I choose this one because of the people in it and the general atmosphere within in. I made a complaint as I would have done to the management of a pub when one of the clientel stepped over the line. This particular management decided to do something about it. I don't know if I was the only complainer or not.

Messie, before I come to the above quote, there is a process in place to allow people to complain, you shouldn't feel the need to hide because you voiced an opinion. Equally, you shouldn't have to apologise for it either.

I don't agree with your thinking, but the process exists for a reason. No judgement from me.

A few people have mentionned that 'something is different' - and I agree. Back when I originally had the feeling, I couldn't put my finger on it. I'd spent a while away from the .Org due to personal reasons, and when I came back, I felt like it was a very different place. It seemed a lot worse in terms of atmosphere. Talking to other people, everyone I spoke to about it echoed my thoughts.

To be honest, when I started coming back to the .Org, I considered not bothering because the atmosphere had changed so much (just as Messie put about it being like a pub - if I don't like the pub, I won't go back). But I stuck with it, and slowly the feeling passed.

Recently, I have definately noticed an increase in the enforcement of rules, and it's a very fine line to walk. I feel for the mods as they feel it neccessary to increase enforcement on the forum. TBH, with regards to that, I've had no warnings personally, but I really couldn't give a damn about it. Though it would of been nice for the mods to announce "ok guys & girls, we've had a re-think, and we're going to take things a bit more seriously from now in" - though that may well of resulted in a flame war.

If you got to this point in the post, you're still reading, and you're not a mod looking for swearing/insults - I'm impressed.

EDIT: I liked Blue's threads, but I honestly didn't notice he'd gone anywhere.

[fizzwheel]

Maybe it has changed, but what are we supposed to do we all know what the rules are, so should we let people off if they break the rules so it doesnt detract from the atmosphere ?

We dont have many rules, its not hard to follow them. If we all stuck to what they were then we wouldnt need to wrap peoples knuckles / enforce the rules in the first place.

Believe me when I say I dont like banning people or putting them on restricted access. I dont want to do it, but if we let a minority of peeps do what they like, then ordinary, quiet folks who come on here who stick the rules will leave and I dont want to be part of a forum that lets that happen. I will not let a small vocal minority shout down the general forum populace.

Bigape touches nicely on whats been going on in another thread, he said something like.

Some people come onto an established forum and then try and change the way its used or run, because they dont like it.

Its bit like the people around my neck of the woods who move to the country and then complain about the smell of cow sh*te or church bells that ring to loudly on Sunday morning...

Originally Posted by Baph

Recently, I have definately noticed an increase in the enforcement of rules,

Quite right you have. But the reason for this is as you explained before. There is more unsettlement than of times past. This is because the moderators have been too lax with the rules.

I am sure you have heard the expression before. Give an inch and they take a mile. This is how it has been on the forums. Too much has been given and certain people have taken advantage of this to 'flex'. This has caused more than usual negative activity.

Us mods have discussed this very issue, the result is a stronger enforcement of the rules. Not just that but also what some would call heavy handed approaches to people who seem to not necessarily break the rules but just rock the boat. As I also said in a different thread. The rules were there before you (not directed at you personally now, but everyone) arrived on the forums. Abide by them or go elsewhere. It really is that simple.

People can complain and dispute their rights to express themselves in any way they think they deserve. However, it is not a right. You are being given a privilege to join and remain a member of the forum. If the moderators make a group decision that you are disruptive then consequences will follow. If you don't like the way the moderators run the forums, or you think you are being suppressed and not allowed to express yourself in the manner you want, or you don't like the U rating or the way your mate is being treated by the moderation team. Well guess what? You found your way here, I am sure you can find your way back out again. Go join Visordown where slagging off, flaming and trolling are actively encouraged. You'll fit right in.

If however you like the site, have made friends here, enjoy the light hearted banter and would like it to continue, then how about supporting the moderators instead of starting threads just so you can vent your anger or frustration. That just compounds the issues moderators have to deal with and adds to the bad feelings on the site.

[dizzyblonde]

Hahaha i know whats changed..... all us old fogies have got older and theres a load of young uns joining, with their hot headed ideas and ill manners and pushyness and foul mouthed vocabulary



....then again part of that rings true, but then so does the fact that the org has grown in a monumentous way, i see so many new folks arriving daily at times i can't keep up with the hello threads anymore...so what we going to do? Stop all new comers joining because the lot that have been here for ages take offense at their new ideas and opinions...
..of course we ain't we just all got to learn to give and take a little, obey the rules and make sure new comers are aware of it, and to that i come to the conclusion of cake...yes that old peach, well someones gotta make light of a horrid situation, i had a giggle joining in the bun fight for a while, we actually stopped the whole bad feeling for an entire weekend, all this about bannings and restrictions was almost forgotten about

meh....just shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh if that helps any
oh and I'm not trying to light the touch paper or owt, just joining in the debate

[northwind]

The .org's always been very light-touch for admin, other than enforcing the u-rating. I think up til this year the only banning was GYKD, and even he was allowed back. Oh, maybe we banned Couch Commando, I can't remember for sure. But if anyone seriously thinks this forum's over-moderated, try some other ones.

But light touch only works when people don't take the mick... and some people take the mick. Neio obviously- I doubt he'd deny he was deliberately trolling and being disruptive, even without the outright abuse he was always trying to push the limits. Not to mention the genius combination of "I have strong opinions and I have the right to state them as often as I want" and "I hate the fact that you have an opinion of your own" which is, basically, all he ever said. (as far as I can tell, nobody in human history has ever said "I have the right to an opinion" without simultaneously trying to suppress other people's)

Blue as well- Blue gets away with a lot because he can give a lot back but even he wouldn't claim he's not a s***-stirrer. (and sometimes, i think he just went a bit further than he meant to, I remember a couple of times when he upset specific people and I know he had no idea that it was going to happen)

Both of those guys have had more complaints, warnings, short bans etc than you'd probably believe. I'm not a proper mod, just a regional one, but I'm always amazed by how hard the real mods try to NOT tread on people's toes, and banning's always been a last resort. I wouldn't do it myself, no chance. The reason there's been more banning/modding lately is purely because there's been more p***-taking lately, IMO. Most people, when treated like adults and allowed fairly free rein, would respond like adults, some people don't, that's basically all it comes down to.

My view... I found Blue's posts tedious and sexist. I think I intimated as much on some of them. It got very boring and frankly offensive. I didn't know that he had received warnings. If he had and persisted - just desserts. We all have to live within the rules - whether we like it or not.

Originally Posted by fizzwheel

...

Fizz, I did type out a proper reply to your post above, but since then we've had a few emergency calls in the office, and I didn't hit submit. Essentially, it was along the lines of "You know roughly what my feelings over it all are in part due to PMs I've sent you."

Originally Posted by northwind

I'm not a proper mod, just a regional one, but I'm always amazed by how hard the real mods try to NOT tread on people's toes, and banning's always been a last resort. I wouldn't do it myself, no chance.

I've deliberately had no ill words for the mods over anything that's happened on this site since I've joined. That's because I've moderated sites (and administrated servers as a whole), and I honestly prefer totalitarian approaches when I'm the one in power. It's less of a headache if you exterminate the problem, rather than just shoot it with a water-gun. But that's just me.

(Now everyone, be thankful that I'm not a mod! )

[dizzyblonde]

I hate football... as I see it, and please do correct me if i'm wrong in this assumption....

in a football match referees are there to make sure the game is played fairly and when those that step out of line. like headbutting, elbowing and verbal abuse, the offender gets a yellow card. When they get the red card its because they haven't learnt their lesson, so away they go..off
The mods of a forum are indeed ( in my naive eyes) like referees, they have a job to keep the forum tidy, keep members in line, and when someone is very very out of line from the forum rules and guidelines they get their use restricted (after much referal between themselves and much consideration) if they carry on going against what is seen as the right way of playing they get the red card by being banned.
Its probably not an easy thing to do being a mod, and at the end of the day, i think they make good decisions, and most importantly the right ones....for the good of all members of the org

Originally Posted by dizzyblonde

please do correct me if i'm wrong in this assumption....
Its probably not an easy thing to do

Sorry, but you asked for it. In the past, I've banned someone from using a college computer network because they kept forgetting their password. Hitting the big button marked "ban" is the easy option - if you're thick skinned.

You do upset a lot of people that way though.

On the whole, looking at everything objectively, I don't know what was done by the mods to stem the rule breaking prior to restrictions/bans, but who cares? They have the right to hit that button should they deem it necessary - even without prior consultation/warning, and they did so.

Originally Posted by dizzyblonde

Lots of nice stuff

I love you I do.