AR Marking Discussion

Yep its all well saying everyone mark.. but I don't want to. And some people of less riding experience might not be happy with it. This system works, so I don't think it needs changing.
Plus I have 4x4's to hassle.

[Messie]

[quote=Grinch;1908377]Yep its all well saying everyone mark.. but I don't want to. And some people of less riding experience might not be happy with it. This system works, so I don't think it needs changing.
Plus I have 4x4's to hassle.[/quote]


I hope you don't!

[fizzwheel]

Originally Posted by Skip

I think this is the problem - people have seen how it works and want to be one of the supposed "priviledged few" who get to overtake everyone and make it back to the front rather than being "herded" from one stop to the next.

It is some of the problem. I think some of the problem is that people dont understand how stressy it is leading a big group of riders, When you have a dozen or so on a regional rideout its not so bad, But I was very nervous about the AR rideout.

But not having markers IMHO encourages racing / aggressive riding and the AR ride is IMHO not the place for it. Let me give some examples if I may

I got buzzed on AR06 by somebody maknig their way up through the pack, He passed me so close at speed that it made me jump out the seat, I reckon I could have moved my elbow out by a CM or two and he would have hit my elbow.

I got aggressively overtaken by somebody else doing the same to the point I had to brake so hard to avoid hitting the back of them that I nearly sent my pillion into orbit.

I didnt pick last years markers on riding ability, If thats how it is being percieved then that is the wrong perception.

I picked last years markers because I knew

That they would stop to mark a junction

That they would stop in a safe place and not put themselves or others in danger

That they would wait at the junction until TEC came into sight or caught them up

When I was out in front leadnig I didnt want to have to worry about whether junctions were marked and when my Dad was out in front leading I didnt want him worrying about it either. Dad was worried about leading as he had never done so for such a big group of riders, he said to me afterwards how well the ride had gone and that he liked seeing a group of Yellow bibs behind him as he knew that the route would be marked properly. It made him more relaxed and he enjoyed his day a hell of lot more because of it.

[Spiderman]

I'm not against a change in the system if we can agree a away that will WORK.

AR06 got to be a bit of a joke at points. I remember riding with another bike beside me who i know. She shouted across that she was looking forwad to dropping off and would i stop with her to look at something on her bike.

It was John (ride leader) then us 2 and then a fair gap before the rest of the pack. Until a group of 3 or 4 bikes decided that they wanted to be in front of us and mark again, i was fairly sure they had dropped off a couple of junctions before to mark so they must have ridden thru the pack pretty fast to get back up here.

And the fact they had no respect for us 2 waiting in line behind the ride leader was just pathetic to be honest. So they drop off at the next junction and me and friend think 'great, our turn next' until the next couple of idiots decide to fly past us, almost past John too and pull in just in time to drop off again.

the point of marking is NOT the ability to ride like a muppet back to the front and scare the bejezzuz out of some on the way. Its to simply make sure no-one gets lost.

Now the difficulty i see is fiuring out who wants to mark and who dont out of the whole pack. Grinch for example is capable and has done it before but simply doesnt want to and tere should be no pressure on him or anyone else who deosnt want to, for whatever reason, to join in and do it.

Demonz...i know how he rides and the coupe of times ive ridden with him in small groups has been pure joy. hes fast, safe and above all fully aware of the riders(s) behind him when making overtakes and other moves. Using him as an example only cos i know how he rides. No reason why he cant be a marker in either system as far as i'm concerned.

However, if we want the whole group to participate how do we, on the day, know who doesnt want to mark without simply asking tem to stay in a pack together at the back of the ride? really dont want to see tons of peeps with bibs on who are happy to mark and less without bibs cos again it creates this unseen "them and us" mentality that we dont want.

So suggestions please about how we can make a system work that includes everyone.

And PLEASE can we keep this thread ONLY about how to set up a system that works and not about who wnats to do it this way or that way.

if you have a constructive idea abuot a new system, lets hear and discuss it please.

[anna]

Why change something that works and is safe.

I dont meant to be funny here but, the only reason why people are even contemplating changing this is because it is felt that people who are markers have a little "power" over others.

So instead of just ignoring the few, who seem to have ego agendas going on, other posibilities are now going to be considered that quite frankly will be a less safe option for the majority.

Markers worked on AR04,05,06 and 08. (Couldn't make 07).

Dedicated markers work even better. Especially if carefully selected. There are a few who marked 08 that in my opinion just used it as an excuse to ride like an idiot. I don't think anyone should volunteer; everyone should wait to be asked if they wish to participate. So long as you have markers who know what they are doing, it is completely irrelevant if they have ever run the route before or not. There are plenty of people involved with the organisation this year to find enough people they consider have the skills required to participate.

[SoulKiss]

Originally Posted by Stig_Of_The_Dump

Markers worked on AR04,05,06 and 08. (Couldn't make 07).

Dedicated markers work even better. Especially if carefully selected. There are a few who marked 08 that in my opinion just used it as an excuse to ride like an idiot. I don't think anyone should volunteer; everyone should wait to be asked if they wish to participate. So long as you have markers who know what they are doing, it is completely irrelevant if they have ever run the route before or not. There are plenty of people involved with the organisation this year to find enough people they consider have the skills required to participate.

There is only one "problem" I see with this.

As mentioned, some people see the Markers as being "special" and getting treated differently.

So if a group or people that ride regularly together end up getting chosen for just that reason - ie they know each others capabilities, then there are going to be people complaining about cliques ad the like.

To my mind being a marker is not a great thing, you have to stop, maybe in the middle of a VERY enjoyable bit of riding, then wait at the side of the road for however long until the TEC appears, then you are under pressure to get to the front before the next x junctions are passed, in a safe and considerate manner.

I can appreciate why Grinch has said "thanks but no thanks" already this year.

Again, Supervox has planned the route, he probably already knows how many markers he needs, and I am sure he has a number of people picked out for that, and if he's coming up short, will ask them in turn for their recommendations.

[fizzwheel]

Originally Posted by Stig_Of_The_Dump

There are a few who marked 08 that in my opinion just used it as an excuse to ride like an idiot.

I never saw that, being either at the front or at the back.

Its important to pickup on what Simon is saying here. Its not an excuse to ride like a tw*t. If theres people out there reading this and are thinking

"If I'm marker then I can do what I want when I want and ride like a moron"

Then you've mis-understood the job.

I've got my name down for marking this year, I'm happy to give it up and let somebody else have a go, but you should understand just what you're getting into. Its not an easy job to make your way safely up through a big pack of riders....

[ophic]

Originally Posted by Stig_Of_The_Dump

I don't think anyone should volunteer; everyone should wait to be asked if they wish to participate.

Totally in agreement here. It's a privilege not a right. In fact its not even a privilege its a job. If people actually want to stand wearing a fluoro bib at the side of the road... there's 363 other days of the year they can do that.

I found 06 getting buzzed by a marker was just as annoying as those you riding with. Perhaps banning overtaking altogether would be a safer option - but rather boring too I guess.

I think the issue Anna brings up is a valid one and probably relates to the forum/mod issue again. Who is 'in' and not 'in' - and how to include those that feel excluded so the event is a greater success. Hence my suggestion for this. I agree with you all - the main thing is safety and if you feel it would be a compromise then its not worth it.