New SS600 GP class... thoughts?

Originally Posted by ThEGr33k

Hmmm. OK then. Interesting!

Wonder what the cost is...

Thats still not the same level of performance the modern ones kick out I dont think

90hp from a 250cc is pretty good! But I would guess that you could tune the engine as well. The current 250cc are supposed to kick out about ~100hp at the rear. As for cost, I remember looking a while ago and think these were about ~15k!

I've loved watching the 250's so far, can't say I know who many of the riders are but the racing is usually pretty close. I guess the relative lack of power means that rider skill can make the biggest difference. It's great to see them wringing the neck of the bike and tucking in tight behind the fairing, slip-streaming the guy in front to make a pass. Other than the 125's, how many other classes do you regularly see 5 or 6 bikes dog fighting over first place and the lead changing lap after lap?

Personally, I see the 125 & 250cc classes not as a way to drive technology forward for the benefit of the manufacturers’ road- going machines but as an apprenticeship for the riders and teams to improve their race craft before moving up to 800cc, or wherever.

If there has to be a new class that isn’t two stroke then keep it simple and inexpensive but unique to MotoGP. Let the riders and teams concentrate on learning their trade getting every ounce out of the bike before moving up to the next level. 600cc is just a little too close to the big boys and has too much in common with road-going machines and IMVHO, I think the quality of racing will suffer.

Just my £0.02.

I can't see it taking off, Superstock is hardly a huge hit.

I personally love the sound and smell of the 2 stroke machines, and if it's not broke, why try and fix it?

[jambo]

4 strokes to make it cheaper?

Look at the pathetic line up in the blue ribboned class, compared to when they were 500s. There's half a grid, there are works bikes and last year's works bikes. That's it. When the 990s came it it was supposed to level the playing field, what it highlighted was the phenomenal cost of developing a bespoke competitive 4 stroke race engine, and brand new chasis to suit it. Only a handful of factories can afford to do this.

If they're going to use a low tuned cheap motor, fine, but I'm not sure I see the point, and the 250s are mad to watch, I want one


Jambo

If they limited it to twins it would be interesting.

That way we'd see some development, but with the top class being 800cc, I can't see it happening.

.

Should have gone with 500cc V-twins or parallel twins.

Something with a gimmick.

Trouble is the 125s will lap quicker than the "intermediate class" unless it's 600cc IL4 or close to it. 500 twins are pretty much a nono.
BRNO:
2008 600 supersport pole: 2:03.2
2007 125 pole: 2:06.8
2007 250 pole: 2:01.3
For reference GP Bike 1:56.8, WSB: 2.00.1

So you see the 600 4 stroke bike would take some work to get to current 250gp laptimes there, 250s are closer to the WSB pace. The picture is similar at every circuit.

As I said before I think leaving well alone is the thing to do. But, if they must change it, I don't think this is too bad an idea, if the costs are comparable to current 250 costs. It would be interesting to see just how much quicker a "prototype" chassis can get a 600 il4 around a race track. Unfortunately it will be a Japan only affair if the engine has to be SS600 derived, and Kawa won't be interested since they suck . Unless of course the Europeans release some brave CBR/R6/GSXR fighting road motorcycles with IL4 engines. Maybe BMW might at some point.

Originally Posted by The Basket

Should have gone with 500cc V-twins or parallel twins.

Something with a gimmick.

I agree... The thing is they could tune the twins to have about 80-90BHP fairly easy, which should only be a little off of the current 250's, they might even manage more. These are race bikes and yes that might not be the cheapest thing out there but its not that bad once they have the engines designed and running.

Ban all the complex things like electronics and special valve setups... spring only for example and you will have fairly cheap racing.

Using this they will be lighter and have a smaller profile than the ss600's so will be faster id bet, especially in the corners.

[fizzwheel]

Originally Posted by sinbad

250gp laptimes there, 250s are closer to the WSB pace. The picture is similar at every circuit.

I might be wrong, but I'm sure I remember working out that the 250 pole laptime at Donnington was good enough for a mid grid spot on the Moto GP grid and that was during the 990cc days...

Like I said I think this might be the case I'm not 100% sure...

Originally Posted by The Basket

Should have gone with 500cc V-twins or parallel twins.

Something with a gimmick.

Well we have the mini twin class in club racing, which what I would to go for.....

Looking at from the racers side a cheap fun class, its whats required if entry fees were less it would help some what. I think that would be the most fun to watch to watch, however I was trying not yell out loud watching the moto gp at work. (i got left in corner to watch it) thats what it should be about it!

It should be more about the rider rather than their ride, I think that makes great racing. I used to race sail boats we would all be the same class, it was very close racing not mention the arguments. (though when I played baseball, one our choaches got so mad he went for the manager of the other team) It was dam good fun, thats why I do things for fun.

When it becomes about the bike, it does make differnence and people with potential get left behind, casue they run out of money....how many of could afford to race of our own back? I know when I decide to, there is help without I would suffer.

250 racing would be awesome and suits my build, however the 2 stoke bikes require lots of attention which also cost money.