Scared myself so bad I need to ask a question...

[yorkie_chris]

Losing the front will result in a slide, locking the back up then releasing it when it has stepped out will result in a highside. Inconvenient at the best of times.

[dizzyblonde]

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

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75/25 is utter b0llocks when you want to stop quickly.


keep the bike in the powerband above 7k (you need to get out of the corner as well as around the apex), brake hard until you run out of space, then turn in hard, drop your inside elbow, look at the exit and get some gas on. Remember the bike is better than you, you will make it around the corner.

hmm don't be so quick to dismiss the 70/30 rule. Schools teach it for a good reason......control. I have had some very very bottom clenching moments almost stoppie moments and have used the technique very well. Never ever locked the SV up in these situations using it either.

As for keeping it over 7k.....only time my SV gets over that is on the motorway some don't feel they need to rev the crap out of a bike

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by dizzyblonde

hmm don't be so quick to dismiss the 70/30 rule. Schools teach it for a good reason......control. I have had some very very bottom clenching moments almost stoppie moments and have used the technique very well. Never ever locked the SV up in these situations using it either.

As for keeping it over 7k.....only time my SV gets over that is on the motorway some don't feel they need to rev the crap out of a bike

If you were getting anywhere near a stoppie with 1/3rd of the braking from the rear you would have locked the back up.

A stoppie is a situation with NO weight on the back tyre, no weight = no reaction force = NO GRIP.
In that situation 100% of braking is coming from the front tyre.

The hardest you can possibly stop is when the back tyre is only just in contact with the deck.


If you try to brake hard, like properly hard, and use much more back brake than what the engine gives you, then it will be time to slide. You can use this for entertainment, but it's not advisable nor advantageous.

[dizzyblonde]

Chris come down from the technical tree a moment, and talk laymans.

Progressive braking, I understand that.

The OP has not been riding long IIRC, If I'm baffled well...

Whatever I learnt about braking from schools,cbt etc went out the window years ago , they teach you that stuff as a "General" rule to keep you upright , I have spent more time servicing my back Brakes from lack of use , I only use them when I have a pillion or it is severely wet , the front does my work if it is needed and let`s face facts ...... you can talk as much "Theory" as you like , when those Anchors HAVE to go on I seriously doubt anybody here will be thinking "Hmmmmm Yorkie Chris said to do this , but Dizzy recommends a ........." you will be doing everything you can to get that bike under control and only experience will prevail on that front .

The best thing you can have learnt from all of this is the fact you are still alive and don`t get yerself into that situation again ...... easily said I know , we all have our moments where it goes breasts up

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by dizzyblonde

Chris come down from the technical tree a moment, and talk laymans.

Progressive braking, I understand that.

OK bike has a certain amount of braking effort available.
As you use it up you come closer to a slide.
At 100% of possible braking (i.e you are slowing down as fast as is possible), you are using all front brake, using 1% of back brake will slide it, using another 1% of front brake will stoppie.

You say you nearly stoppied a bike using 30% rear brake? Nah, because a stoppie is 100% front brake, and if you did manage it then you must have dragged the back fully locked up, or got it off the floor before braking with the back!

Schools teach 70-30? Yeah they also reckon my stopping distance is the same as a f##ked ford anglia on crossply tyres!

7krpm, having the bike in the correct gear for a corner is the only way it will feel right, you need to drive it out of the corner not just let it chug round. In a panicked cornering situation like the OP, the bike "feeling" just right is what is needed to avoid totally losing the plot. You need to keep a bit of aggression to keep the panic under control, if you think "FUUUUUCCCKKK" then you will crash, if you think "GRRRR ... AV IT" and keep looking at the exit then you will make it around.

Anyway, bigfoot, you've had the "moment" now, fear like that is perfectly normal, but it really is all in your head. [cliche]There is nothing to fear but fear itself [/cliche]. Plan ahead a bit more next time aye

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by xXBADGERXx

Whatever I learnt about braking from schools,cbt etc went out the window years ago , they teach you that stuff as a "General" rule to keep you upright , I have spent more time servicing my back Brakes from lack of use , I only use them when I have a pillion or it is severely wet , the front does my work if it is needed and let`s face facts ...... you can talk as much "Theory" as you like , when those Anchors HAVE to go on I seriously doubt anybody here will be thinking "Hmmmmm Yorkie Chris said to do this , but Dizzy recommends a ........." you will be doing everything you can to get that bike under control and only experience will prevail on that front .

The best thing you can have learnt from all of this is the fact you are still alive and don`t get yerself into that situation again ...... easily said I know , we all have our moments where it goes breasts up

Search for sid squids post on practicing "panic" braking. Follow his advice, build the muscle memory to brake progressively, build the instinct to release the front if it locks.
Leave the back alone.

EDIT See 2 posts below. That is pretty much the only way you will get it right...

[dizzyblonde]

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

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You say you nearly stoppied a bike using 30% rear brake? Nah, because a stoppie is 100% front brake, and if you did manage it then you must have dragged the back fully locked up, or got it off the floor before braking with the back!

Anyway, bigfoot, you've had the "moment" now, fear like that is perfectly normal, but it really is all in your head. [cliche]There is nothing to fear but fear itself [/cliche]. Plan ahead a bit more next time aye

ahh perhaps you misread, I did say 'almost stoppie moments'.

But aye aye to the last bit

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by Sid Squid

Yes you can, and you should.

Do this: Find yourself plenty of space with a good flat surface somewhere you won't be disturbed, this is important, very important.
Ride at about 30mph on a neutral throttle and grab the front brake as hard as you can and let it go immediately, and I really mean immediately. The front wheel will lock and, as long as you follow instructions, release straight away.
That's the sensation that you need to be able to recognise, and once you practise that a few times you soon will. The time to learn what that feels like isn't when someone pulls out in front of you, you need to know now.

*Disclaimer* As long as you follow the above, particularly the words about releasing the brake immediately, you will not crash, in fact as you practice you will be able to moderate the brake pressure to bring the brake as close to lock as possible and hold it there, this I would suggest is a vital skill and a lot of fun. I have taught many people to do this and no-one has chucked it away, it's a skill you will learn quickly and if you can't bring yourself to do it when it doesn't matter you'll never use the brakes effectively when it does.

hth

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by dizzyblonde

ahh perhaps you misread, I did say 'almost stoppie moments'.

I did not misread.

"almost stoppie" implies that the back tyre was somewhere near ready for coming off the ground, meaning sod all weight on it.

No weight on a tyre = no grip. No grip + "30%" = sliding tyre