What the hell is wrong with people ?

Originally Posted by SteveH

Guys I understand where you lot are coming from but things need to be cleared up first
1) there was no sign of the kid when they arrived, or how long he had been under water
2) these ppl are not trainned in water rescue, some police can't even swim
3) "pond" was no pond as in your back garden type thing this was deeper then a swimming pool, ex gravel site


Now you arrive knowing what you know now
Still jump in risking your life? over a job you get payed £20k ish a year

I have a one year old daugther at home , which means I no longer think about myself now

P,s not everyone reacts the same ,you can't expect someone to risk their life like you would

After a shock from what I initially heard, I found out that the real events were exactly as Steve says and I agree totally - if I had arrived at a large expanse of deep water and was told that somewhere out there a lad had gone under I would say that it would be pretty pointless (unless I could swim underwater like a fish) to dive in and try to get him out. It seems like the press have, as usual, got hold of some basic facts and twisted them out of all recognition to make a sensational story.

[Supervox]

Reading the replies above I'd like to add the following :-

I'd say that our PCSO's are not being correctly / sufficiently trained. IMHO the ability to swim should be a basic requirement for the job.

BTW - it's been reported that the 2 anglers waded in to pull the little girl out, so it couldn't have been that deep.

What the hell does '20k a year' have do with anything ?

If you don't like the salary, or consider it unsatisfactory for the tasks expected of you - then don't take the job !!

This was Manchester again, wasn't it? The same force that reportedly didn't turn out in response to a call when a youth pulled an AK47 from a bag on a railway station. The same force whose chief constable and and local MP Graham Stringer tried to bring a private members bill recently to require all 'off-road' motorcycles to have a registration plate - so; racers, scramblers, museum pieces, etc., because of the mini-moto problem.

I've had no water training, other than my mum teaching me the basics of swimming and my dad showming me how to dive properly.

So technically, since I dont have any sort of certificate, I shouldnt jump in and save someone from drowning.

But

I still would. Just because you're not "trained" it dosnt mean you "can't" if you actually know how to do so. I'm not a motor vehicle technician, yet I can do an oil change. You guys arn't chemists, yet you still use chemicals. These police officers or whatever they are may not hold formal training certificates, yet I bet one of them can swim.

Whats wrong with people nowadays? No-one seems to take a milligram of initiative and do something right, they have to be told.

Matt

Its a terribl situation, and i think in this situation i would have jumped in - i am a strong swimmer anyway, and i think in their situation i would have.

But peopel now days are scared to help in case they get sued etc. there a re numerous cases of well meaning passers by later being sued by the person they attempted to help because they did somehting wrong. its rediculous but i bet if these guys had uoped ina dn the kid had still died, they'd have ben charged with something or dragged over the coals by their superiors. i think they made the wrong choice personally, and my thoughts go out to the parents, but the legal state of this country makes people hesitant to do what they feel is right.

EDIT - god my spelling sucks today!

I personally would have jumped in.

However, let's remember that when they arrived they did not see a child drowning, they saw nothing but a pool the size of a football pitch.

Also, to those who condem PCSOs think of this; Had there not been PCSOs there do you think there would have been Police Officers instead? No, there would have been no one patroling the area at all. In the West Midlands area, prior to the introduction of PCSOs it was very rare to see a PC on foot patrol, partly due to lack of resources and partly because the vast majority of PCs prefer to travel by car responding to the 'exciting' aspects of policing.
PCSOs on the whole do a good job.

[Bluepete]

Here is the story as reported in the MEN
http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...._just_stood_by

It's not a deep gravel pit, just a flash. It's hard to believe that anyone wouldn't do something, I think I would, but I wasn't there.
Just out of interest, who here would be happy to let their 8 and 10 year old play next to a large pond like that with no adult supervision? The mother was interviewed after the coroners verdict and it was obvious there were no adults with them from what she said.

My 2p worth.

In this case the PCSO's are totally out of order, the only reason for one or both of them to stand there and not go in is if they themselves could not swim, and even then they could have tried to wade in and get the kid.

Common human instinct would have told you to go and help. If it was me as either a PCSO or as na innocent by stander then i would have been stripped down and in to get the kid out ASAP. These two deserve to be sacked for gross negligence.

And it should be part of the requirement for the Police and the PCSO's to take a basic swim test of say 25m and being able to tread water.

Yes, in an ideal world, they'd be trained for every eventuality. In reality, this is impossible and overly costly. So instead, as common sense would dictate, at least one of the pair would have been able to swim (and if neither of them could, someone ought to really question pairing the two of them on a beat near water), they should have got in the water to save the kid, whilst the other got on the radio to call for an ambulance. They then, if either of them knew it, should have attempted CPR (if necessary). Again, if neither of them knew CPR, someone should really look at the training programme/wisdom of pairing these two together.

I agree about being panicked, Brian: I spent years learning and teaching how to dress wounds in the scouts, only to freeze up when I came across my mother bleeding fairly severely from an (accidental and self inflicted) knife wound. Thing is, this panic lasted for about 15 seconds, then I realised I needed to snap out of it and help her. You'd hope people whose job it is to put themselves into dangerous situations to help others, on a daily basis would be a bit better at dealing with this panic...

[mattSV]

Originally Posted by BluePete

Here is the story as reported in the MEN
http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...._just_stood_by

It's not a deep gravel pit, just a flash. It's hard to believe that anyone wouldn't do something, I think I would, but I wasn't there.
Just out of interest, who here would be happy to let their 8 and 10 year old play next to a large pond like that with no adult supervision? The mother was interviewed after the coroners verdict and it was obvious there were no adults with them from what she said.

On holiday in SW France this year, my brother in law and I rescued two dutch girls (aged around 11-12?) who were being taken out by a rip-tide. They had been playing in the Atlantic surf, with no adult supervision, and could not get back in - the bit of beach they were on had no life guards, however there was a guarded section only about 1/4 mile away. We always went to the unguarded section, as it was quieter, and the surf was better.

The parents turned up about 1/2 an hour later - we then had to rescue the father, who did exactly the same thing

Found out when we got back from holiday that a teenager drowned on our last day, on the same section of beach that we went to.