TLW down:(

Originally Posted by Sosha

But that was someone else paying for taking you out. Not quite the same.

Until she admitted blame it was classed as fault , either way it doesnt matter as the insurer has to put the policy holder back into the position of were/how they were BEFORE the claim

Originally Posted by the_lone_wolf

because they have to have a rough idea to give you a quote, do you think if i'd told them it was worth £10,000 on the speculation that used prices would rocket they'd be stamping out a cheque for that much, even having taken more from me in the premium?

you still don't seem to understand that when you insure a vehicle you don't insure a cash amount, you insure it so that if it's written off you get a vehicle identical to the one you had immediately before the accident.

You're right, I'm not an expert on the ins and outs of insurance but you said 'The insurers have made a valuation of £6k, claiming that is the maximum they can offer as it's the value I put on the form' which seemed perfectly reasonable to me. As I said, if you can get more then fair play but why push it when you can buy something like Ed's bike for £5750? That is at least comparable to the one you've lost (ok so slightly older with a few more miles but it's barely run in and you'd put that mileage back on in a couple of months) so the insurance valuation is probably about right.

In fact the word/clause i was looking for is this:




Indemnity Insurance: This means that the insurance co undertake to restore the insured to the financial position he/she was in before the loss occurred. The insurance policy comes into existence where the client agrees to pay a premium in return for indemnity insurance. The premium is determined by the RISK, which the client represents to the insurer, RISK in turn is determined by:

• The likelihood that a loss will occur, based on the characteristics of the drivers, the vechicle and the risk address.
• The probable cost involved if a loss should happen.

(working for a ins co has its upsides at times )

but also:

Actual Cash Value (ACV) – Put simply, Actual Cash Value is the value of an item at the time it was damaged by the insured event. ACV is calculated as Replacement Cost Value (RCV) less depreciation. Start with what it will cost to replace an item at today’s prices and then deduct from that value according to the age and condition of the item. Depreciation is usually figured as a percentage of its actual age or as the percentage of the expected life of an item

and:

Replacement Cost Value (RCV) – The actual cost to replace a damaged piece of property with another of like kind and quality (LKQ) at current market prices

"The probable cost involved if a loss should happen."


Probable cost here implies that there are no fixed boundaries.

£6000 was the value of the bike at the policy inception.

It will probably go down. But then again it might not.

[Gazza77]

Originally Posted by carty

Then why do they bother asking you the 'value' when you insure it. If you state £3k or £10k on the valuation you will pay a different premium yes?

Try doing a few quotes online simply changing the value of the bike. In my experience, changing that one variable makes no difference whatsoever to the premium.

I've never understood why you have to declare the value for insurance. As stated by other posters, you are insuring the market value of the bike, not a stated value (unless you have an agreed value policy, but that's deviating from the point).

Originally Posted by Paws

Actual Cash Value (ACV) – Put simply, Actual Cash Value is the value of an item at the time it was damaged by the insured event. ACV is calculated as Replacement Cost Value (RCV) less depreciation. Start with what it will cost to replace an item at today’s prices and then deduct from that value according to the age and condition of the item. Depreciation is usually figured as a percentage of its actual age or as the percentage of the expected life of an item

and:

Replacement Cost Value (RCV) – The actual cost to replace a damaged piece of property with another of like kind and quality (LKQ) at current market prices

So if they offer 'Actual cash value' you'll get a lot less as all new vehicles lose money as soon as they're registered / driven off the forecourt. That's why people buy gap insurance on new vehicles isn't it?

If they offer 'replacement cost value' then there's no reason why they can't offer the price for any 8 week old supersport motorcycle, eg, a new or nearly new GSX-R600 as that would arguably be of 'like kind and quality'.

Either way, I still think £6k is a pretty darn good offer.

Originally Posted by the_lone_wolf

i didn't "insure it for £6000" - that's not how it works

i gave them a value of £6000 at the time of insuring the bike, at that time it accurately reflected the cost of purchasing another identical bike, if i'd written it off pulling out of the dealers then i'd have been perfectly happy to accept it and go back into the dealer, or any number of dealers, to buy another

the insurer's responsibility is to offer the market value of replacing the bike with as close to an identical bike as possible, which currently is more than what they've offered

Quoth the financial ombudsman:

"We are likely to award the policyholder the full retail value, even if he/she inadvertently under-estimated the value of the vehicle when filling in the proposal form or luckily bought the vehicle for less than it was worth"

Woolfie, read your policy booklet, it forms part of the Insurance contract you and the Insurers are bound by. Look at the Special Conditions on page 12, it specifically states that any total loss settlement will "not be more than the value shown on the schedule". Also, "we will pay you the market value of the motorcycle at the time of the accident up to but not more than the value shown on the schedule". Now assuming the schedule value is the £6k you declared, then this is the maximum Insurers will pay you.

The ombudsman will only provide you with a judgement other than this if he deems the contract terms to be unfair, which is unlikely.

Originally Posted by Paws

Actual Cash Value (ACV) – Put simply, Actual Cash Value is the value of an item at the time it was damaged by the insured event. ACV is calculated as Replacement Cost Value (RCV) less depreciation. Start with what it will cost to replace an item at today’s prices and then deduct from that value according to the age and condition of the item. Depreciation is usually figured as a percentage of its actual age or as the percentage of the expected life of an item

and:

Replacement Cost Value (RCV) – The actual cost to replace a damaged piece of property with another of like kind and quality (LKQ) at current market prices

Paws, correct me if I'm wrong but the RCV is taken from a new item. So ACV is the price to buy a brand new item less depreciation.

However if you are replacing used with used then if the replacement is of similar year and mileage, it has been subject to the same depreciation as the insured vehicle. Therefore ACV equals RCV, if the replacement is used and is the same age with the same mileage.

Originally Posted by carty

So if they offer 'Actual cash value' you'll get a lot less as all new vehicles lose money as soon as they're registered / driven off the forecourt. That's why people buy gap insurance on new vehicles isn't it?
.

Yup and thats why ive taken out GAP ins on my 675

So a couple of pages later we're back to the best option, 'buy Ed's bike'