Track Bike

Originally Posted by Blue_SV650S

To me it is a waste of cash that could be better placed elsewhere ....

Were you thinking crash bars and mushrooms, spare forks, taxi fares, etc.

Sorry, that's a low blow but I couldn't help it.

Originally Posted by SV650Racer

LOL.

Why the laughs? Did I say something funny or silly?

[northwind]

Originally Posted by Blue_SV650S

But why do it at all??? it's not the nicest job, high risk if you make an alignment error (even more likely if you are using an inlet as an ex as the standard markings are no longer used) … and will set you back >=£100 and for what (real world) advantage???

It's not high risk at all if you check your work and test-turn the engine after you do it, which to be honest you'd have to be an idiot not to. (though every year at least one SV Rider does it to be fair) Only real risk is if you manage to drop something down the cam tunnel, which is always on the cards but is completely preventable if you plan for it.

I'd do it because it makes the bike nicer to ride, not neccesarily the power (though it's nice to have) but also the delivery- the longer peak with the ex cams is the difference between a gear change and not inbetween the bottom of duffus dip and glenvarigill at knockhill, I've found, to give you a wee "real world" frinstance. There's loads of time when being able to hold onto a gear can be a big advantage, even if like me you're not out to knock off seconds it lets me think a bit more about the approaching corner instead of what gear I'm in.

I wouldn't call it essential at all, but it's also not stupid. I do agree that there's other things that are better to spend money on, that's why I was recommending suspension, but it's out there as an option and not a bad one, certainly far better than exhaust systems and rejetting for a track bike IMO.

Originally Posted by northwind

... is the difference between a gear change and not inbetween the bottom of duffus dip and glenvarigill at knockhill, I've found, to give you a wee "real world" frinstance. There's loads of time when being able to hold onto a gear can be a big advantage, even if like me you're not out to knock off seconds it lets me think a bit more about the approaching corner instead of what gear I'm in.

A simple change of sprockets will do exactly the same ...

I agree, its a good mod, I just don't think the gain/benefits are great enough to warrant it unless you are getting serious/racing. or you pick a set of cams up for nothing I uspoose...

The geeza has already said he doesn’t want to throw money at it … if he was going to spend money at a trackbike he would get a GIXER … that is the logical approach to me …

With this in mind, the engine isn't going to get a look-in??

Originally Posted by northwind

There's loads of time when being able to hold onto a gear can be a big advantage, even if like me you're not out to knock off seconds it lets me think a bit more about the approaching corner instead of what gear I'm in.

Out of the Bus-Stop down into Devils Elbow at Mallory, for instance. I usually short shift two gears as soon as I'm out of the Bus-Stop and drive down into the Elbow a gear higher than I'd prefer, so I don't have to change up a gear while cranked over half way down the hill. Being able to hold a gear longer there would make life easier.

Maybe I should just learn to be faster through the Bus-Stop and carrying a higher gear to start with, then there'd be no real need to do the change half way down the hill. But, my instructor mate tells me that the Bus-Stop is one of my better and faster sections, so I'm not going to push it any further.

[northwind]

£50 for a set of carbed model intakes and a pair of gaskets, not a big investment if it's a bike you're going to take to half a dozen £100 trackdays I reckon. But yep, we basically agree I think, I'm just throwing out options.
You'd definately have to be a bit wrong in the head to scrimp on the suspension in favour of power..

Disagree on the sprockets though, that'll shift where one gear works but it won't make it work on a wider range. Then again, it might be my rubbishness/lack of competetiveness coming through, I suppose though I can make it work through a wider rev range I should probably still be making the shift and staying closer to the peak...

Originally Posted by Lozzo

Out of the Bus-Stop down into Devils Elbow at Mallory, for instance. I usually short shift two gears as soon as I'm out of the Bus-Stop and drive down into the Elbow a gear higher than I'd prefer, so I don't have to change up a gear while cranked over half way down the hill. Being able to hold a gear longer there would make life easier.

Maybe I should just learn to be faster through the Bus-Stop and carrying a higher gear to start with, then there'd be no real need to do the change half way down the hill. But, my instructor mate tells me that the Bus-Stop is one of my better and faster sections, so I'm not going to push it any further.

..... Or change the sprocket ratio ... you can really 'tune out' a lot by changing the gear ratios!!

Originally Posted by northwind

£50 for a set of carbed model intakes and a pair of gaskets, not a big investment if it's a bike you're going to take to half a dozen £100 trackdays I reckon. But yep, we basically agree I think, I'm just throwing out options.
You'd definately have to be a bit wrong in the head to scrimp on the suspension in favour of power..

Disagree on the sprockets though, that'll shift where one gear works but it won't make it work on a wider range. Then again, it might be my rubbishness/lack of competetiveness coming through, I suppose though I can make it work through a wider rev range I should probably still be making the shift and staying closer to the peak...

The idea of changing the sprockets is so you can select a gear that works better ... if you are running out of revs in one gear ... then you have 2 choices, either change the sprockets such that the bike will take a different gear (higher - but not bog down), or make the gearing 'taller' (you don't have to reduce ratios, you can increase them too northy )... have you tried different sprocket combos??? I suggest you do, it can make quite a difference to how the bike 'takes' a lap ...

Oh and as you know I HAVE done the cam swap in my bike (like for like though). Would I do it to another bike* - NO!!

Oh and you forgot one thing ... those cams you buy for £50 will still be worth £50 when/if you want to sell ... but again as you know, could I find any pointy cams when I wanted??? No, they are like rocking horse poo and therefore you either have to be lucky or pay through the nose ... I ended up buying a complete pointy engine to get my cams ... that was an expensive old game ...

Finally - you will always have to compromise .. even with the cams ... I have my SV (with pointy cams) on the limiter about 2/3 way down silverstone back straight .... I could 'gear' this out, but I'd loose so much elsewhere, I have chosen to sacrifice a few MPH down the back straight ...

Originally Posted by Blue_SV650S

I ended up buying a complete pointy engine to get my cams ... that was an expensive old game ...

Should have bought some sprockets instead

[northwind]

Originally Posted by Blue_SV650S

The idea of changing the sprockets is so you can select a gear that works better ... if you are running out of revs in one gear ... then you have 2 choices, either change the sprockets such that the bike will take a different gear (higher - but not bog down), or make the gearing 'taller' (you don't have to reduce ratios, you can increase them too northy )

Oh and as you know I HAVE done the cam swap in my bike (like for like though). Would I do it to another bike* - NO!!

Aye, I get all that, but the point is I run the revs lower then ride it out all the way, so changing the gearing in either direction would impact that, since all it can do is shift the range. I'm probably too inconsistent to finetune the gears in that way, but the wider range means you can get away with a bit less accuracy too I reckon, which is could if you're me

Didn't you do the minitwin-legal full cam swap though? Not quite the same.

Originally Posted by Lozzo

Should have bought some sprockets instead

touché

However, I only bought the cams coz I was thinking of racing the SV - that is when even small HP differences do matter ...

I also changed the sprocket ratio front and rear