suspension question - what and why

Originally Posted by ThEGr33k

Cheap, doesn't handle the road as well as a more expensive option. The difference between a good after market and any stocker is massive tbh. My Penske is AMAZING on the falco... Wouldn't dare go back.

Ok, good to know. And shocks from other bikes like ninja and gsxr? Are they better/worse than aftermarket shocks made for SV? Are they usable on road? I suppose shocks from supersport bikes should be a bit on a stiff side, no?

[the_lone_wolf]

Originally Posted by ThEGr33k

Well then thats wheels and discs.

not only wheels, inertia is a mass's tendency to remain stationary resisting motion (from the word inert) - having a large mass higher up, making the centre of mass higher where it has further to travel when the bike gets leant over means it will not turn as quickly as a bike with a lower centre of mass, all other things being equal

as for putting GSXR suspension on an SV and them handling the same, not likely, the suspension on a GSXR has been designed for the GSXR, same with all the modern supersports - these days the manufacturers have to make the bikes handle to the limits of affordable tech to be competitive in the 600/1000 market. the suspension will be of better quality, and likely have a wider range of adjustable settings, so you'll find something that you like, and that's better than the stock SV, but a good aftermarket shock designed for the SV and it's frame geometry, rake, trail, COM and myriad of other variables will be better still

Originally Posted by ThEGr33k

Well then thats wheels and discs.

Though im still fairly confident having more weight up top makes a difference, I can tell the difference between a full and empty tank.

+1. Upon an empty tank, my handling gets sort of worse (less planted feeling). Also, if my topbox is light, or I dont have it on the bike at all, the bike dosnt drop into turns as easily. It seems to me having saome weight up top helps. Sure, it'll make it hard to flick over to the toher side...but thats what muscles are for

I'm going to order a new hagon rear shock today or tomorrow, since my current item is the OEM shock...10 years old, +36,000 miles. I don't beleive I need to change the fork springs (maybe the oil, it'll be a bit old by now) as I am quite light and don't really load up the front end

Should I expect to feel a differance...?

If you do get Hagon shock, please write your impressions here, so I don't miss it Seems like Hagon shock is one of the cheapest aftermarket shocks around, so it's an interesting alternative.

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by Domas

What is exactly wrong with SV (pointy) original rear shock? Is it the same problem as with forks? Not much low speed compression damping and too much high speed damping?

It's naff. It's an emulsion type shock, which means gas and oil are free to flop around however they want in a froth. A proper shock keeps gas and oil seperate, and has valving which cost more than 4p to make, so actually keeps the wheel under control.

Originally Posted by ThEGr33k

Well then thats wheels and discs.

Though im still fairly confident having more weight up top makes a difference, I can tell the difference between a full and empty tank.

So you're saying a GSX1100EFE or some other monster drops into corners better than some razor sharp GP bike?

It might drop in, but for a bike to feel like it handles well it must be easy to stop it dropping when you need to! For that you need a low moment of inertia about the contact patch. That moment of inertia is a function of how much the thing weighs, and how high it is from the ground.



Get some gixxer forks and shock, and throw £500 at them, and it will handle better than a new GSXR/YZF/C*R/ZXxR because it will be set up for you rather than some rough guess by the factory.

Ride height yadda yadda, all this can be changed.

I would guess that the CoG of an SV will be lower than the CoG of an IL4, half the cylinder barrells and heads are a lot lower to the ground, and there are only half as many.

[the_lone_wolf]

Originally Posted by alpinestarhero

+1. Upon an empty tank, my handling gets sort of worse (less planted feeling).

which do you want? handling or planted? if it's feeling skittish it sounds more like the bike is undersprung for your weight, a heavier bike will feel more planted simply because there's more inertial mass that needs to move to respond to bumps in the road, but a heavier bike will require far more effort to flick around the corners, which isn't the definition of handling

the trick is to get a lighter bike with suspension suited to the weight of the bike + rider, then you'll have a planted and flickable bike, my KTM is an example, light as a feather but feels incredibly planted and stable on all surfaces because of the top shelf suspension adjusted to my weight...

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by Domas

Ok, good to know. And shocks from other bikes like ninja and gsxr? Are they better/worse than aftermarket shocks made for SV? Are they usable on road? I suppose shocks from supersport bikes should be a bit on a stiff side, no?

No. To take an example the GSXR 600 SRAD shock is much softer. 750 is a little harder (iirc) but longer and works well.
They will not behave as well as a shock built for SV and importantly built for the rider. But they are 1/10th the price.

Originally Posted by Domas

If you do get Hagon shock, please write your impressions here, so I don't miss it Seems like Hagon shock is one of the cheapest aftermarket shocks around, so it's an interesting alternative.

I would not bother with a hagon. They are not much different from stock, still an emulsion type shock, though they may be better set up (higher spring rate, thicker oil perhaps).

Given some cash to blow I would take a SRAD 750 shock, send it to maxton or PDQ and get them to spring and valve it for me.
Total cost about £280 and this will work, for all intents and purposes, as well as ohlins etc.

Get Penske two way adjuster... £600. Well worth it

With a decent shock set up right you'll be able to feel the grip and feel when its searching for it. Lumps in the road wont throw you out of the seat and the bike will be more "planted", mine actually feels better leant over now than sat up. ha.

Originally Posted by the_lone_wolf

which do you want? handling or planted? if it's feeling skittish it sounds more like the bike is undersprung for your weight, a heavier bike will feel more planted simply because there's more inertial mass that needs to move to respond to bumps in the road, but a heavier bike will require far more effort to flick around the corners, which isn't the definition of handling

the trick is to get a lighter bike with suspension suited to the weight of the bike + rider, then you'll have a planted and flickable bike, my KTM is an example, light as a feather but feels incredibly planted and stable on all surfaces because of the top shelf suspension adjusted to my weight...

I tell you what I dont want; a bike that feels like its understeering alot...

[the_lone_wolf]

Originally Posted by alpinestarhero

I tell you what I dont want; a bike that feels like its understeering alot...

understeering into or out of corners?