PSNI 1 Thieven Git 0

[andrewsmith]

Originally Posted by davepreston

im having to clean the coffee off my work desk now, fecking priceless

to answers some q's
better cos we dont let tealeafing git away with it

look at that poor cop in london that was stabbed repeatedly bet he wishs he was carrying

all our cops have guns not just certain units

if i was carrying and someone was robbing a shop with a knife and came towards me (imminant danger to life), id shot him phone a ambulance and keep my gun on him ,in case he moved and if required shot him some more

you dont shoot arms and legs, because they easy to miss, if your going to shoot someone its to put them down end ov, like the army theres no such thing as a warning shot, unless you call the first round going into the bloke beside you then you can concider yourself warned

Good reasoning!!

The warning shot is normally that with our lads.

Originally Posted by specialone

Ed, your so fecking liberal
Probably a bit much for a robbery at knife point, but choose that path in life then what do you expect ?

Two possibilities.

1. We now know that the bloke had form, lots of. But the officer wouldn't have known, so unless the bloke physically attacked the officer with the knife I wouldn't have expected him to shoot.

2. The officer did know this bloke, after all the list of previous seems quite long. So decided 'I've caught him, this cesspit needs taking out' and bang bang, goodbye. Not acceptable.

[Nobbylad]

Question Ed...the man holds the knife against someone's throat to steal their money. They are allowed to walk away, with the faint chance that they might be caught, in which case the crime would be added to a very long list of previous and may not even result in any prison sentence being awarded. If they are sent to prison, the likelihood with this particular individual is that they will re-offend (as they have proven to have this inclindation).

Is that a society you wish to partake in? Are you prepared to continue to pay tax on your hard earned money to support such people? To provide shelter, food, clothing, amenities (TV, gaming, gym facilities) for them when there are people who do not commit crime who are more deserving of such provision but don't necessarily receive it?

You can't paint everyone with the same brush and everyone's situation is different, but from the look of it, this chap was a well versed crim and basically got his comeuppence after making someone fear for their own life (if he did hold a knife to their throat).

Not saying I approve in his death, however I don't feel an ounce of sympathy.

Yes N-lad, I do indeed.

To me, human life is precious. I think that prison is too soft - it's not meant to be a holiday camp. And I don't believe in parole, time off for good behaviour, that sort of thing. I think that most American states have it right on this.

People such as the deceased deserve to be locked away for a long time, in a none too pleasant environment. Not shot.

If we go down the execution route, we're no better than the screaming towel heads in Islamist countries where they will lynch someone on demand. And where will it end, and who decides, and what about all the miscarriages of justice that have seen so many released in recent years after lengthy prison spells?

No, never.

Ok here's another scenario, off duty cop lets him go to spare the situation escalating, he jumps in a car and a chase ensues, he loses control, kills a family of four, he survives, justified ? Shot dead earlier, four people still living.

What about he gets away, challenged by an un armed on duty cop or have a go hero, during struggle, he stabs them to death, justified ? Cop shot him dead earlier, innocent person still alive.

Both the above are perfectly possible.

i guess you could look at it the other way, what would people think if the copper wasnt carrying and the bloke stabbed him and he died. Its easy to say shoot him in the leg or arm or not take his life but when put in a life and death situation no one really knows how they are gonna react. If i was in the same position its a fight for survival in my eyes and id be glad i had the gun in my hand! Theres also the fact that no one really knows what actually went on yet, its mostly just speculation

if he hadn't took a knife to the garage and robbed it, he wouldn't be dead.

Not saying it's right or wrong. But every action has an equal and opposite reaction. If you take a weapon and intend to use it then you have to accept you might get hurt/arrested/shot dead for your actions.

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by Ed

Is this what happened



Just cos someone has a knife is no reason to shoot. And if the police officer was in the petrol station building and felt his life was threatened, he was presumably close enough not to miss an arm or a lg?

Friends, taking another person's life - whatever they have done - is never something to celebrate. I will never believe in 'eye for an eye' nor in death sentences.

So I suppose that we will have to await the outcome of the investigation.

So this guy has a long record, it's not a massive leap of imagination that he is some sort of crackhead, madman or other mental deficit.

Have you ever fired a pistol? How big a target is an arm? You are asking a man whose life is threatened* to further risk his life for the sake of some feckless c*** rather than immediately negate the threat with reasonable force. Bugger off man! Liberal as you may be we are talking the difference between legitimate self defence and a duty of care over an attacker?** Do you understand what you are asking there? Seriously? Look at it this way, cop takes a pussy *rsed liberal shot at this mad, crack smoking, knife armed lunatic, who then proceeds to fillet the officer. You've then got a crack smoking mad lunatic armed with a gun!

Example #2, you take a shot at someone's arm, where does the round go when you inevitably miss? Does it strike a hard surface and kill a bystander? Fair enough a 9mm has an even money chance of going right through a head, but that's better odds than hitting a moving arm with a disabling shot. One has a pretty good chance of not penetrating a torso and so being absolutely no risk to any bystander.

I don't care about his record particularly, or if the cop thought "we'll have you now". If there is sufficient grounds to say "yeah your life was in danger, clean shot" then absolutely brilliant. If he intended to kill him knowing full well that he didn't have to then I don't particularly mind either, the guy was asking for it putting himself in a situation where he could get legally murdered.

*And him being so far innocent of murder means he was justified in opening fire

**Which is what you are suggesting to say that he should have gone for his arm or leg.

Shoot him in the arm or leg??? its not the movies folks. Centre mass always. Speak to anyone who has been trained / done some real shooting at real targets. I'm sure i will be happily corrected by someone with more knowledge but the effective range of a handgun is not very far (range at which you could reasonably be expected to hit what you are aiming at) Also there is a distance where a knife is considered more effective than a gun (23ft i think) something to do with taking longer to aim and shoot than the knife guy would take to stab you.
Watch footage of real life shoot outs, cops and robbers exchanging rounds from 30 yds and missing each other.
If he felt he or others were in danger then taking the persons life was justified. IMHO

Originally Posted by Ed

Two possibilities.

1. We now know that the bloke had form, lots of. But the officer wouldn't have known, so unless the bloke physically attacked the officer with the knife I wouldn't have expected him to shoot.

2. The officer did know this bloke, after all the list of previous seems quite long. So decided 'I've caught him, this cesspit needs taking out' and bang bang, goodbye. Not acceptable.

Ed in reply

1-point one - or putting someone elses life at risk , so yep can agree with that.

2-second scenario -WTF!you must be taking the pi$$ with that-so just cause the guys a career crim the cop would decide to murder him-you come across as an intelligent guy but that scenarios bordering on funny farm entrance material.

h