Attempted Robbery @ Ducati Croydon

[Bibio]

he would as he actively pushed the person off the ped without provoke. it's ok to defend yourself but to a point once past that point it becomes retaliation. the staff member should not have tried to stop the thieves and just phoned the police and any good brief would have the staff members up in court for assault. everyone knows this is wrong but that's what your supposed to do as its an act of theft and not life threatening, if the assailants turn on you then you are allowed to defend yourself (within reason using reasonable force which is a very very grey area).

i could go all tinfoil hat but i'm in a good mood

Or you could just say you genuinely felt your life was being threatened (as in, the guy had a claw hammer and was swinging it at me) and then you're pretty much covered.

[Ch00]

Good job

Only the guy in white seems to overstep the mark...

[Bibio]

that was after the fact. and would not have happened if they thieves were allowed to get their swag. yes in court the thieves would get done with attempted theft but the staff would get done with aggravated assault. all the the thieves need to say in court is they were forced to do it for monetary value as they were desperate to which they would get a tag and fine for the attempted theft. but the staff started the assault and would come out of it worse as the thieves would claim they were defending themselves. the theft part would hardly come into it and would be a minor point in the trial if someone were to be seriously harmed.

A fair point, long gone are the days of an englishman's home is his castle etc. But having said that, the recent spate of burglars being killed and the homeowners walking free is encouraging. In the nicest possible way.
They went armed which has to go against them.

[Fallout]

Originally Posted by Owenski

I've just watched it a few times through and its a hammer from under his seat, it only comes out when he gets pushed off the scooter and his seat pops open.

How mortified would you be if that were you and you were just in the wrong place wrong time etc... I'd be expecting a nice apology ducati some time soon lol.

I've watched it too mate, and I think it's obvious he's involved. He turns up at exactly the same time (I bet there's other CCTV to show him riding along with them earlier), and he goes up to the door with them. If people are dragging a bike out of a door with shout and screaming (presumably) you don't run right up to touching distance before realising the shop isn't open for usual business! Plus he rode off with them.

Originally Posted by Bibio

he would as he actively pushed the person off the ped without provoke. it's ok to defend yourself but to a point once past that point it becomes retaliation. the staff member should not have tried to stop the thieves and just phoned the police and any good brief would have the staff members up in court for assault. everyone knows this is wrong but that's what your supposed to do as its an act of theft and not life threatening, if the assailants turn on you then you are allowed to defend yourself (within reason using reasonable force which is a very very grey area).

i could go all tinfoil hat but i'm in a good mood

I don't know mate. I know exactly where you're coming from, and I think there is a chance he could be done, but I think the innocents being prosecuted thing has been exaggerated by the press a lot. In that instance I think he could indeed face charges, but I don't think he'd be convicted as he wasn't really that violent. He pushed them, then retreated, then pushed again!

At least, that's what I'd hope would happen. The paper would have you believe he'd be hung drawn and quatered for that crime, and his children put on spikes on London Bridge, but in reality I think this only normally happens in more extreme situations.

Originally Posted by Fallout

The Daily Mail would have you believe he'd be hung drawn and quatered for that crime, and his children put on spikes on London Bridge,

Corrected for you mate

[Fallout]

For once, an accurate correction.

I am pretty sure you are allowed to use reasonable force for the protection of property to. Obviously that force is not as great as self preservation.

It does look like the guy in the high viz had nothing to do with it. To me it does not look like he attacked anyone, and he only got the hammer out when the ducati guy pushed him over (i.e. self defence) he never swung it back (i am fairly sure there is case law giving this as the definition as intent to use), and backed off as soon as soon as the imediate threat to him passed. He then put the hammer back in his scooter, and was about to ride off when the ducati guy pushed him over again. (bear in mind that the scooter rider at this point did not have anything in his hand.)

If I were a ducati executive, i'd be VERY annoyed at staff at this shop. Not only is there a potential assault charge, ok permissiable in the heat of the moment and an appology from the staff member directly would go a very long way to righting that (if it were me). But then posting a video on youtube, branding someone a criminal before a trial has taken place, with company name all over it. It will also likely make it harder to secure a prosecution, if they do catch them, the crims can claim that they wouldn't get a fair hearing etc.

But +1 good on the first staff member. 1 v 3 and kept hold of the bike.

I'm not saying he was/wasn't involved. I just think it would a proper head scratcher if it happened to me, in fairness its the sort of thing that would happen to me.