Lance Armstrong

[maviczap]

Originally Posted by Spank86

If there is such a thing as pre doping.

No, but it was much cruder, just amphetamines & caffeine. These were just used for quick fixes

EPO boosted the red blood cell count, which allowed the user to train for harder and longer, and recover quicker. Tyler Hamilton & David Millars quotes about what it felt like when using EPO were 'riding without effort' if I remember correctly.

Blood doping used your own blood stored from the off season, when your blood was at its best, and hadn't been knackered by months of racing. Tranfuse knackered blood mid race with fresh red blood (bit like a oil change i suppose). Instant recovery, with no risk of not waking up, as could happen with EPO

Human growth hormone is the drug that could be creeping in, but in cycling I don't know of any positive tests.

[Littlepeahead]

The time has come to switch to slow bicycle racing. Anyone can try to ride fast but slow is tricky. You must have tried it with your mates as a kid.

[BanannaMan]

Very disapointing.










Should not be surprised I suppose.
Every sport I've ever been around, at or near the top level, invovled cheating of some form by nearly everyone involved.

Originally Posted by Bri w

1999
1. Lance Armstrong
2. Alex Zülle (‘98 busted for EPO)
3. Fernando Escartín (Systematic team doping exposed in ‘04)
4. Laurent Dufaux (‘98 busted for EPO)
5. Ángel Casero (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)

2000
1. Lance Armstrong
2. Jan Ullrich (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)
3. Joseba Beloki (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)
4. Christophe Moraue (‘98 busted for EPO)
5. Roberto Heras (‘05 busted for EPO)

2001
1. Lance Armstrong
2. Jan Ullrich (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)
3. Joseba Beloki (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)
4. Andrei Kivilev
5. Igor González de Galdeano (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)

2002
1. Lance Armstrong
2. Joseba Beloki (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)
3. Raimondas Rumšas (Suspended in ‘03 for doping)
4. Santiago Botero (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)
5. Igor González de Galdeano (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)

2003
1. Lance Armstrong
2. Jan Ullrich (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)
3. Alexander Vinokourov (Suspended in ‘07 for CERA)
4. Tyler Hamilton (Suspended ‘04 for blood doping)
5. Haimar Zubeldia

2004
1. Lance Armstrong
2. Andreas Kloden (Named in doping case in ‘08
3. Ivan Basso (Suspended in ‘07 for Operacion Puerto ties)
4. Jan Ullrich (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)
5. Jose Azevedo (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)

2005
1. Lance Armstrong
2. Ivan Basso (Suspended in ‘07 for Operacion Puerto ties)
3. Jan Ullrich (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)
4. Fransico Mancebo (‘06 implicated in Operacion Puerto)
5. Alexander Vinokourov (Suspended in ‘07 for CERA)

So if Alex Zulle was busted for EPO, so it was obviously discoverable in a test, how come LA wasn't busted once in over 500 test covering xx years. Some of those test were totally at random, i.e. someone knocked on his door at home... And there's a bunch of guys who've got insignificant bans and their race results overturned for their testimony. Now you have the US Anti doping Agency telling the UCI to strip LA of his titles.

Maybe he is guilty but it should be proved with scientific evidence from the samples they've been storing for years, not some 'bought' testimony of proven cheats...

Great post! Just about sums it up perfectly!

[maviczap]

Originally Posted by Berlin

Great post! Just about sums it up perfectly!

Yes it does, it shows that use of EPO & blood doping was endemic in the top tier of the peleton, and to win required everyone to use it.

Anyone thinking that Armstrong was so far ahead through his natural physically ability that he could do without dope is a bit naive.

Ok you could dismiss Tyler Hamiltons & Floyd Landis testimony as they had an axe to grind against Armstrong, but when Hincapie & Christian Van der Velde said that they knew & were involved in doping with Armstrong, they've got no beef with him, so why would they testify against him?

Armstrong cannot win the Tour on his own, he needs a team around him, Hamilton, Landis, Hincapie, Van der Velde all used EPO or blood transfusions as members of the US Postal squad, he was never that far ahead on natural ability, he needed to dope.

But if they were all doing it he still won. So why don't they just give it a rest. Surely the riders who came 2nd were all dopers too, so it seems pointless giving the titles to others.

Cycling should just move on.

[pookie]

Maybe somewhere down they line there might be some guy who genuinely rode without doping and he deserves to be rewarded for his efforts .. but it certainly does cause a bit of a mess regarding the results over those years. But who knows have far down the line you go?

Originally Posted by Littlepeahead

The time has come to switch to slow bicycle racing. Anyone can try to ride fast but slow is tricky. You must have tried it with your mates as a kid.

Hell yeah, they should have a ring with some obstacles and kerbs and the last person still upright wins.


That was a great game as a kid, cutting each other up and trying to stay upright while barely moving.

[Biker Biggles]

Originally Posted by pookie

Maybe somewhere down they line there might be some guy who genuinely rode without doping and he deserves to be rewarded for his efforts .. but it certainly does cause a bit of a mess regarding the results over those years. But who knows have far down the line you go?

I know-----Lets award those titles to the bloke who came last each year.Surely he must have been clean,if we can remember who it was.
Did Jimmy Saville ever do the tour?

Well if EVERYONE was doping, level playing field then?

I don't want to believe it, have read all his books and was in awe of him. Sadly most people given the chance are lying cheating *******s.