Motorbike ABS.

Originally Posted by GavinD

But you don't have to fully disengage - just ease off! I have had to do this in one of those heat of the moment times -you don't just let go when it locks!

True, but you still have to release. Braking hard when you riding quickly is one thing, but when the one off thing happens - a kid runs out of nowhere, its cold, wet and greasy - then its nice to know you can anchor it and it won't lock up

Originally Posted by flymo

I think ABS is a great innovation on a motorcycle. At the end of the day if your wheel is not rotating, or at least not fast enough then it isnt producing grip, cannot influence your direction (which is a problem with a front wheel!) and cannot slow you down using your brakes. Hence ABS.

ABS will improve over time, it has already come on leaps and bounds, mostly due to the performance and speed of the sensor electronics. Same as traction control in most aspects.

The argument in racing circles is not that its no good but that its actually too good and takes away the need for rider skill usually at high expense for the very latest incarnations.

If you have felt ABS activating then its saved you from a lock up that you would certainly have had it not been there. As far as complexity goes, all you have to remember is to keep pressure applied to the lever, pretty simple really.

Exactly. I have a really simple system on mine, but it works. It does have flaws, but overall its very good for road use.

Another 2-3 years, bigger companies, more technology, it'll be commonplace on most roadbikes. It really does work.

It's funny but I remember 20 or so years ago when ABS just started becoming popular on cars and all the arguments about how good/bad they were. Usually it was the smart alec I'm-so-good-I-can-brake-better-without-it who had the most 'issues', fast forward to today and who would buy a car without it? Can you even get a (mainstream) car now without ABS? Although it was correct to claim that a good driver could do better without in reality what most people against the system missed was that ABS can brake individual wheels (which the driver has no way of doing) and the driver can keep control of the steering while all this is going on.

I know things are different on a motor cycle with only 2 wheels which (mainly) have individual control but most motor cyclists don't brake very well.

I have seen tests in a monthly motoring magazine where they appeared to come down against ABS (although they were a bit non-commital) as they found that they could achieve shorter stopping distances on a non-equipped bike - but this was after several runs under test conditions when that child runs out in front of you there is only one chance. Also ABS is not just about braking it is about stopping the wheels from locking. I know that sounds stupid and the same thing but not locking the weels is very important on a bike as no rotation means no gyro and then you fall over very easily even if you don't hit something.

My current bike doesn't have ABS but I'd like to have it and I expect to have it on a bike near me very soon!

Just to correct the misconception Plowsie had on the first page: if ABS fails, it won't stop your ability to brake. For example, Honda's new ABS on the CBR has an electromagnet in the system: should the ABS fail, the power to the electromagnet (no power = no magnet) is cut and the brakes return to simple hydraulics (ie. complete manual control). There's no harm in the way ABS is integrated into the braking system.

I think most, if not all, the people who don't want ABS are either overconfident in their abilities or just haven't tried riding a bike with ABS yet. It's a huge safety aid because even the most skilled of riders will struggle to overcome that instinctive grab for the brake when something happens with just a millisecond to respond; it improves safety without interfering with riding. The BMW with ABS (think it was a R1100 or whatever the big naked is called) I rode had impeccable manners: absolutely normal braking until a car pulled out in front of me when the ABS kicked in and stopped me locking the front. It was still a **** bike but that's down to the horrible gearbox.

[flymo]

Originally Posted by merlin427

...not locking the weels is very important on a bike as no rotation means no gyro and then you fall over very easily even if you don't hit something.

I strongly doubt that gyroscopic forces have much to do with anything when you are zipping along with a locked front wheel Just a matter of time before you hit the floor anyway.

Originally Posted by plowsie

Learn not to lock up, simples...

Edit: My last two offs were from locking the front, no other reason, poor front brake control by me. I would like to try ABS.

I've learnt how to stoppie the Versys without causing the ABS to make it's presence felt - you'd be surprised at just how much braking force you have at your disposal before the wheel locks/ABS cuts in.

The thing is, having ABS has given me the confidence to explore those braking limits without skittling the bike. Try those shenanigans on a normally braked bike and you stand a good chance of putting your bike in the scenery. I've learned that I can hit the brakes hard and still keep the front wheel under control, and I have fun braking hard on wet manhole covers just to freak my riding mates out

The Versys has an ABS option that I took because it was thrown into the deal I negotiated with the supplying dealer. I chose it because I managed to lob my last SV under a car's rear bumper while braking hard and hitting a manhole cover; had my SV been equipped with ABS I doubt I'd have done a fraction of the damage that accident caused. In three months the ABS has already saved me from crashing the Versys twice, so as far as I'm concerned it was money well (not)spent

On my recent crash, ABS would have kept me upright on the bike as it slammed into the car that pulled out in front of me. As it happened, I panic braked, the front wheel locked and the bike slid into the car as I slid alongside it. If I had had ABS, I would probably have managed to lose a bit more speed though.

So in my case, I think I was better off without ABS, but I also think that 99 times out of 100 ABS would be better, so given the choice I'd have ABS every single time, no question.

Originally Posted by ranathari

I think most, if not all, the people who don't want ABS are either overconfident in their abilities or just haven't tried riding a bike with ABS yet. It's a huge safety aid because even the most skilled of riders will struggle to overcome that instinctive grab for the brake when something happens with just a millisecond to respond; it improves safety without interfering with riding. The BMW with ABS (think it was a R1100 or whatever the big naked is called) I rode had impeccable manners: absolutely normal braking until a car pulled out in front of me when the ABS kicked in and stopped me locking the front. It was still a **** bike but that's down to the horrible gearbox.

I agree on teh over confident thing Ranathan, this is what I was hinting at with the folk who reckoned they could do better when this was a new toy on cars 20 or so years ago. On bikes they also tend to be the 'last-of-the-late-braker' type who never brake properly but think they're good becaues heavy braking feels exciting. In fairness the other difference between bikes and cars is that many bikes are hardly riden in the wet and this is where ABS will be most usefull, in the dry you have to be really kack handed to lock up.

Originally Posted by flymo

I strongly doubt that gyroscopic forces have much to do with anything when you are zipping along with a locked front wheel Just a matter of time before you hit the floor anyway.

I think you'll find that the gyro forces generated by your wheels have a major effect on keeping you upright and when it goes you fall over very easily. You have half a chance if you keep one wheel turning.

Originally Posted by SoulKiss

I have also had one off which involved heavy braking, so I think I may be slightly qualified to discuss the topic...

2 dont you mean?

Actually to think about that one on the SV - if you had ABS at that time it may have saved you in that situation. P*ssing with rain, sharp corner ahead, big horse poo in the middle of the road... hand full of brake and it probably would have stayed up right still with you taking the corner. It's not hard to see the benefits.

I think everyday riding they have some good applications but I would really want to see how it feels when it comes on a few times before making any decisions on it. I know on the car it can be quite unerving when you are in a hurry to stop (especially in the wet) and all of a sudden it starts juddering away. Put that on a bike and there is even more to think about (in terms of consequences) so I can imagine it would be quite a suprise if you are not used to the feeling of the ABS kicking in.