child tax credits, child benifits etc.

[Luckypants]

Originally Posted by timwilky

Sorry I posted after an beer argument .....

So unlike you Tim!

Originally Posted by graemepaterson

... all because they have dodgy knees which is because they are fat.....

Bit of a sweeping generalisation again

Actually I have a friend who is (or has been) grossly overweight because they shattered their knee and ankle in a car accident and was unable to walk for 6 months (most of which time she spent in a wheelchair) ... so she was overweight because of her inability to exercise! Not because her weight buckled her knees or ankles.

Sometimes everything isn't as it would seem

[G]

Originally Posted by Pedro68

Bit of a sweeping generalisation again

Actually I have a friend who is (or has been) grossly overweight because they shattered their knee and ankle in a car accident and was unable to walk for 6 months (most of which time she spent in a wheelchair) ... so she was overweight because of her inability to exercise! Not because her weight buckled her knees or ankles.

Sometimes everything isn't as it would seem

That was an example on the bbc investigation. All the people highlighted in the bbc investigation were then invesitgated and found guilty of fraud or something along those lines. Its probably on youtube.

End of the day its to easy for scroungers and fiddlers.

Originally Posted by graemepaterson

That was an example on the bbc investigation. All the people highlighted in the bbc investigation were then invesitgated and found guilty of fraud or something along those lines. Its probably on youtube.

End of the day its to easy for scroungers and fiddlers.

And therein lies the problem with such "investigative journalism" ... it isn't quite as good a story to say "oh yeah, they are legitimate"

However, I do agree that the system is so easy and open to abuse that something needs doing about it.

As others have said, I have no problems with people claiming legit benefits if they are in an unfortunate situation and need the money...BUT, there are a lot of scroats who are working the system ridiculously and it's these that should be stopped (how is the eternal question!)

There is a chap we used to play footy with who lived with his wife and 8 kids in a council house and they had their house free and got literally about £3k per month in handouts. That's the equivalent of about a £60k salary after tax!

As someone who pays a hefty amount of tax I find this disgusting to be honest but what can you do . While the system is as it is people will milk it. As someone else mentioned aswell, I currently pay hundreds a month in N.I. towards doctors / hospitals that touch wood I never use, being a healthy person; and a state pension I will never get. If I didn't pay NI and just had a private health and pension scheme I would be much better off. Perhaps slightly simplistic but you get the picture!

This has nothing to do with the tax system, it's just the benefits system failings. Tax is a whole different ballgame!

Cheers,
Matt

[dirtydog]

Originally Posted by timwilky

OK, now I have stirred the waters and got a few bites. Sorry I posted after an beer argument with a professional scrounger who refuses to work.

Still doesn't make the below quote ok where you refer to a lot of people on here who have children and work bloody hard to pay for them as "scroats" and imply that their children are some unwanted product. Unfortunately we are not all in a position to be able to earn big money every month and claiming tax credits make it that much easier to get by and maybe buy a few luxuries like food! Just because someone claims tax credits of some sort doesn't automatically make them a scrounger

Originally Posted by timwilky

WTF are those all about. Surely if you want children, you should be able to afford to bring them up. Why should the tax pay subsidise the by product of some scroats recreational sh****g.

Maybe you should think about things before posting them, whether you've had a beer or not

Last night I was certainly upset with Timwilky's post, but I know how annoying it is for people. There is a couple who I do call friends who have more spending money due to the fact that they claim for everything and yet I cannot get a 10th of what they get.
Before I came out of work last year I was earning an average of 22k pa. so it's a big huge drop in the household income, however both my daughter and I have benefitted in other ways and the Child Tax Credit helps to pay for the little luxuries like bottles, nappies, toys, clothes and many other small things that are needed.
The Benefit system does need a proper overhaul and each case needs to examined closely, but I bet it would cost the taxpayer even more money to do this than what they currently pay.
As for ending the benefit system and the NHS, we would end up like the US where the vast majority of people cannot afford the medical payments or insurance.
Anyway thats enough of me and my thoughts.

[timwilky]

DD, If you read the rest of my second post. You would see that I would prefer that nobody needed to claim any sort of "Working Benefit". The statutory minimum wage you could earn should be set sufficient to enable a working family to raise their children. and the government recognition that you need to have an income sufficient to live yet tax people earning less than this level and then have to give some back.

Maybe that is why I am against tax credits, they effectively make a two tier tax system and as such financially penalise people that either have no children or are higher earners.

[dirtydog]

Tim I did read all of your post, and i'm sure most people would love to earn enough not to have to claim child tax credits, I know i would!

As for scraping the whole system and raising the tax threshhold how would that stop there being a tiered tax system? £10k might be enough up north but it would be inadequate down here, for instance i pay about that in rent for the year and believe me I do not have a big house

I get what you're saying about it being rediculous taxing someone and then giving it back to them via a benefit because they don't earn enough


So does your son/daughter not claim child tax credits for your grandchild?

I earn what I would call a good wage and as such I am not able to claim tax credits, despite having two children, which annoys me slightly especially as I feel that I am penalised for working hard and owning my own house. My wife has recently had to return to work full-time because of this so now my children are suffering as they have to go to child care from 0730 to 1800 each day. My child care bill exceeds £900 per month, so for the first few months my wife is working just to be in her overdraft.

My mortgage on my house is almost £1k per month, I do not live in a flash house just a simple 3 bed terraced house. I never have any spare cash and literaly work to survive most months.

On the other hand my sister lives in a large 3 bed council house with a massive garden, always has cash on the hip, has every vice you can think of and doesn't work........so I ask you what is my incentive to do what do and why am I not helped a little bit as I am trying to do the right thing. A little tax break would be lovely and certainly help out.

My lifestyle isn't extravagant, far from it. A little help would be nice though.

Since leaving school at 16 I have never scratched on or been out of work as I am pretty much prepared to do whatever it takes.

Some of these comments actually offend me and I'm not really easily offended.