Proposed speed limit change

And bollox to denying drivers who take longer to pass, how arrogant is that.

Just because a person takes longer to acquire a skill doesn't mean they should be penalised for it.

There is no reason or proof that these drivers are any better or worse than others that pass the test sooner. They still pass at a set standard, who's to say mr I passed first time didn't fluke his?

Fwiw I passed both my tests first time. But I think it is incredibly insulting to suggest one should be denied a license because they took longer to learn to PASS THE TEST, when real life driving skills as we all know involves much more common sense. Something in which anyone can lack, passed first time or not.

People dont think energy is created out of nothing. People think a head on crash is worse than hitting something solid and stationary. They would be absolutely correct. Mythbusters tried to call this and 'closing speed' a myth and prove it by showing the same amout of energy dissipated on the car.

A ford focus travelling at 50mph has 2x kinetic energy. When it hits something solid 2x kinetc energy gets dissipated. When two ford focus are travelling at 50mph, they carry 4x kinetic energy. When they crash into each other the exta 2x energy doesnt just disappear. It has to dissipated somewhere. Mythbusters just dissipated it equally between the two cars. The crash was still twice as bad, twice as much energy was dissipated, and two cars got wrecked not one.

A head on crash IS worse than hitting something solid at the same speed. Closing speed is absolutely relevant as the oncoming vehicle is bringing its own energy into the collision. Who it is worse for, depends on the circumstances.

You are interpretating the problem in a different way.

I believe the average person thinks that you will always be worse off crashing into a regular closing car full on than crashing into something solid full on. Which isnt the case. I have asked several people the question and i get the same response.

Depending on the variables you may come off worse or you could get off lightly, do it a thousand times with changing variables it will come out equal.

Im not getting involved in one of these pendatic nit picking threads I understand it and i know what im getting at, and thats me done

Originally Posted by hongman

I don't think it will make much difference to traffic.

People who want to do 80 plus already do, and the people who don't, won't.

Of all the pros and cons I think they mostly rise and fall in tandem, with the net effect being hardly noticeable.

Yep, this is more than likely the outcome, so won't make much difference.

As long as people adopt the 'bubble'** while speeding up it should affect too many things.

In regards to driving tests that a few people have mentioned, we don't need it harder, we need instruction to be greatly improved, minimum amount of hours ( as in pilot training) in all areas of driving, not just how to pass a test.



** Dont know who else was taught this, but imagine an invisible bubble around your car, faster you go the bigger the bubble will be, slower, the bubble can be smaller.
Problem then is the pr*ck in the rep mobile will see the bigger gap as a opportunity to cut in front on you.

[Red Herring]

I don't think the "problem" if we have one is speed limits, or any other legislation. Our issue is with driver attitude and their perception of what is right/safe, or not. Raising the speed limit to 80 will simply tell drivers that that is now the new "safe" speed and they won't even consider the need for a change in their behaviour to accommodate it.

Foreign drivers cope better with higher motorway speeds (by having better lane discipline) because that is what they are used to and they understand it is important, but their driving can be worse than ours in other areas (tailgating for one). If we want to change driver behaviour it can be done over time (look at drink driving over the past 20 years) but you can't do it with a simple change in the law.

If you really want to make british drivers more aware of what they are doing then lets ban seat belts and install a 6" spike in the centre of every steering wheel. It would be carnage for the first six months, but natural selection would soon play it's part....

[dizzyblonde]

Originally Posted by hongman

And bollox to denying drivers who take longer to pass, how arrogant is that.

Just because a person takes longer to acquire a skill doesn't mean they should be penalised for it.

There is no reason or proof that these drivers are any better or worse than others that pass the test sooner. They still pass at a set standard, who's to say mr I passed first time didn't fluke his?

Fwiw I passed both my tests first time. But I think it is incredibly insulting to suggest one should be denied a license because they took longer to learn to PASS THE TEST, when real life driving skills as we all know involves much more common sense. Something in which anyone can lack, passed first time or not.

Have to agree here with MrHongman. I passed my bike test, when it was the old one(none of this part 1 and 2 rubbish), on the fourth attempt, I passed my car test last year, first time.
It doesn't say anything about lack of skill, as with the bike test I got so nervous about 'one' aspect I failed it on that every time! Passed the car test with one minor.......and I'm absolutely rubbish at driving a car(I don't like them and feel uncomfortable unlike a bike). Difference between the two is seven years, and a lot less nerves, confidence as a person is part of it.

On the other hand, there really are people out there that should be taking a test again, as they have either forgotten the rules over the years, or they are ignorant.

We effectively don't have a speed limit on the motorway anyway, because it is not enforced. I posted in another thread about being tailgaited on the M1 everytime I moved into lane 3, by drivers who were travelling at 95+, and it we are not talking one or two here, it was a constant stream of large new family/exec cars for 120 miles. Do what speed you like on the motorway, there's nobody there to stop you.

[Luckypants]

Originally Posted by -Ralph-

France has it bob on IMO. 69mph in the wet, 81mph in the dry, and if you stray much over 85 your very likely to get caught, and lane discipline is good. Tailgaiting can still be pretty bad though

Having just spent several days on French motorways, I have to agree with Ralph, although IME the 130kph in the dry and 110kph in the wet is also applied in other European countries. As for getting nicked, well I saw one police car in about 2000 motorway miles, but obviously the fear is there. The biggest difference is lane discipline in Europe, which means the motorway appears to be clear for long periods as everyone is in lane one.

I was sharing driving with my brother, who considers himself a good driver (but not a keen driver). It was so obvious the difference in attitude to getting back to lane one between a British driver and the French was so obvious... if there was a truck half a mile away, he would stay in lane 2 of a 2-lane motorway until the truck was reached and passed, the French would go back to lane 1 then overtake normally... Lane discipline needs to be enforced and ingrained into UK drivers - this more than anything will help with flow on the motorways I believe.

As for raising the speed limit, I think that is a good idea, but would prefer them to go with continental system of a lower limit for the wet. With the number of variable speed limit cameras around it would be easy to enforce this until drivers were 'educated' to the new system.

And one change that I think would help stop speed creep, change to measuring distance/speed in kilometres, 130kph showing on the clock is much more satisfying than 80mph.....

Mways are so much better in France and their drivers are more disciplined and not pulling in after an overtake annoys the feck out of me but most of the mways I went on in France were nowhere near as busy as ours, so at times I don't think pulling back in would be possible or practical.

Does anyone else notice the change in standards after 9.30am or on weekends?

When I use mways at these times, there are slower drivers, more that don't move over after overtaking, pull out on you without looking etc etc.

I don't agree with the 'time saving' argument - it only saves you 10 minutes over 100 miles!

Distance = 100 miles

Speed = 70, Time = 85 minutes
Speed = 80, Time = 75 minutes