Direct access good or bad..... Gimme some facts!

I have voted within 2 years! (looks like I'm the only one!!)

I did drop my bike within the first year after my DAS BUT it was on track. I also laid it down on it's side very gently after cocking up a stoppie in the car park at a SELKent meet... Everyone saw it too!!!

I did not have a cxrash in my first year though and have only recently been involved in a crash (as I'm sure most of you are aware) which was not my fault!

I was on the A22 coming out of Eastbourne, towards London. It was the single lane, national speed limit section, just by a turn-off to a local village. There is a waiting box in the middle of the 2 lanes, where one caqr driver was sitting, having pulled out from this turning - waiting to turn towards Eastbourne. Another car driver coming in the opposite direction to me pulled into the waiting box, behind the first guy - he was obviously waiting to turn accross my lane, down the turn-off.
Another car driver coming in the opposite direction flashed the first guy to let him out onto the A22 towards Eastbourne.
The second Muppet (sorry - car driver) "assumed" (his words in his Police statement!) the guy was flashing him to go, so went... Without looking!

BANG!!!

Over the roof I went!! The rest is history!

I am yet to have it confirmed by the Police whether they will be persuing Criminal charges against him!

[northwind]

Originally Posted by Flamin_Squirrel

If you pass the test you have the skill to ride a motorcycle safely. Thats all that's, required to get onto the road and that's the way it should be. Better riding skills, what like road positioning, throttle blipping, counter steering, clutchless shifting, weight distribution? Sure having these skills will allow you to ride faster, but that's not what we're talking about. DAS prepares you for starting you off riding on the road, and does it fine.

I don't really buy that either. I'll say flat out that one of the guys who went to test with me was not reliably riding safely. He got through his test with just about as many minors as you can have, but to this day I have no idea how- he was a disaster even on the ride to the testing centre. Don't think the trainers quite knew how he passed either.

And some of those other skills- especially road positioning- could be trained. Hell, road positioning is an essential safety skill on a bike, I'd say if you can't choose a good road position you're going to be constantly in danger- your visibility is poor (in both senses), as well as being 3rd laned etc. That's what bothers me most about perennial CBT riders, you see them getting themselves into all sorts of terrible places that even a recent DAS passer will know are just bad news for a bike...

I don't think you can seperate "basic skills" and "adanced skills" in the way you seem to be doing. I'm not talking about teachig people how to get their knee down or anything like that- maybe even longer supervised rides could be introduced (I reckon I learned more on the 300 miles to Glencoe and back with my first rideout than on my DAS, which is why I suggest this- just time spent riding and cementing new skills.)

On my first day on the GS500, I ended up going out for a ride "solo" with an instructor as the other guys needed much more attention than me- they were left with the head of the school, I went out with Andy (who came along on one of the SV Ecosse rides on his crazy MZ) and all we did for about an hour was hoon about twisty NSL roads. Usually there's not really time in the DAS course for that, but I found it massively useful. And fun That's the sort of thing I'm talking about when I'm arguing for further training.

Basically, I reckon I learned a bit too much on the road by myself after doing CBT - never binned the 125 but I'll never know how- and probably the same goes for DAS. It worked out not bad for me, but looking back I can see about 10 times I could've ended up in hospital or worse if thigs had gone only slightly different.

I agree about the CBT being abused, but as for the DAS, I think you're missing the point I'm trying to make. If you ride as cautiously as you do on your test, there is no reason that you shouldnt be able to avoid an accident.

[northwind]

Yup, that is true, but also IMHO totally unrealistic Even if the test covered every sort of riding and every condition that we ride in, which it can't, I don't think anybody rides that way every time they get on a bike. I have so much faith in human nature eh?

Originally Posted by northwind

And some of those other skills- especially road positioning- could be trained. Hell, road positioning is an essential safety skill on a bike, I'd say if you can't choose a good road position you're going to be constantly in danger- your visibility is poor (in both senses), as well as being 3rd laned etc. That's what bothers me most about perennial CBT riders, you see them getting themselves into all sorts of terrible places that even a recent DAS passer will know are just bad news for a bike...

I agree- like I said before (cant remember if it was in this thread) on my DAS course I asked how do I go round corners - the instructor said - you dont need to know anything like that just stay upright in the middle of the lane and youll be fine!!

Originally Posted by northwind

Yup, that is true, but also IMHO totally unrealistic Even if the test covered every sort of riding and every condition that we ride in, which it can't, I don't think anybody rides that way every time they get on a bike. I have so much faith in human nature eh?

I think that pretty much proves my point.

[northwind]

Funny, i thought it proved mine. Seriously mate, do you ride as though you were on your test every day? I've never come across a driver or rider that does, and I don't think that "test manners" are the best way to ride, for that matter.

Originally Posted by northwind

Funny, i thought it proved mine. Seriously mate, do you ride as though you were on your test every day? I've never come across a driver or rider that does, and I don't think that "test manners" are the best way to ride, for that matter.

I did when I first got my SV (my first bike). And thats the whole point of the test - the minimum safe standard, yet good enough to reasonably keep you from having an accident until you have more experience.

[fizzwheel]

I think that DAS is all well and good but only up to a point.

Things my instructors didnt cover, that I think now they should have.

Use of the back brake in traffic and during U-Turns
What happens in when you ride in the wet, i.e stuff like leaves, mud, manhole covers, white lines etc etc, yes they said "you have less grip" but they didnt really explain it..

I had the advantage well I think it was of 4 months solid every day riding in all types of weathers on a two stroke aprillia 125 trial bike, yes it wasnt fast but it taught me a lot and to be honest I loved thrashing the knackers of that little bike it was great fun

What am I trying to say.. I don't really know.. I think time spent on a smaller bike and the building up gradually is well spent. My Dad insisted that I didnt get my full license and spent some time on a small bike to build up my skills.. and I think it made me a better rider. Yes I take the point that other have made that you dont always have the power to get out of situations, but then again you dont have the power to get into them either, and riding that 125 at 55 - 60mph feels about the same as my SV does at 115 - 120mph on a private road of course officer.

I dont see how you can limit people to a small bike for 1 or 2 years though, all they'll do is insure one for two years, but not ride and then when the restriction is up go out and buy an un-restricted bike and go off and ride that.. which I think is lethal not riding for two years after taking your test and then getting back on a bike

Just my thoughts

I got hit up the **** 3 months after passing.

Not my fault though!