Turning, cornering, bends etc

[Stu]

I don't know who to credit, but I read this thread yesterday and Conciously counter steered all the way home.
Fantastic, Thanks

[Stu]

Originally Posted by wheelnut

I just thought maybe no one had heard of him :P

Sounds impressive, but who is Keith Code? is he Shinsei Jutsu or is who Shinsei was plagiarising?

I am no one.

I lifted that stuff from another forum, had no idea where it came from, just guessed it came from where the video clip was from. If there is any problem with it then I'm sure admin will remove it.

As I said I am no one.

Originally Posted by Viney

HOW?? Bike wants to fall to the left so you make it go straight on?? Im not saying that it doesnt work, and like you Jellyman, i suppose it jaust happens on the bike, but the theory just doesnt hold right in my head. Doing something opposite to what the bike is naturally trying to do just seems plain wierd.

Seems weird I know, but the physics of it actually work. It's as if you are making the front wheel the "fulcrum" for the bike to pivot, and steering to the right when actually want to go right just reduces the size of the fulcrum, allowing the bike to fall in more qucikly.

Here's an exercise I did to get the hang of it.

Ride down a straight road (with no traffic) along the centre line. Gently "jab" the right bar away from you and the bike immeadiately turns to the left and then back upright.

Do the same with the left bar and it dips to the right.

To really get a good idea of it, ride a naked where you get a more intense feeling of conciously turning the bars the other way. It's scary when you first do it, but great fun...

.

[21QUEST]

Poor guys head must be done in by now :P

I would go with peeps who say use the 'KISS' principle for the moment.

Cheers
Ben

[northwind]

Originally Posted by skidmarx

Mmmmmmmm..........thought so! Interesting article. Sure somebody will be along to 'rubbish' it all, which is a shame really....

Ah, that's not what he said in the PB article I saw... He maintained it's imposible to turn at all. I don't think the rider's experience counts for a thing, since you just don't ride it at all like a normal bike. Sounds like the riding coach had the right idea, probably the only reason I could do it at all was because I'd been shown exactly how... Marc Gillespie could surprise Keith Code I think But he'd still crash if he tried to ride it on the road. (incidentally, what you do is you position your weight off the bike, then pull the bike onto you, if you try and do it normally it either straightens straight back up, or you fall off. Kevin Carmichael fell off, apparently )

The No-Bull**** Bike makes its point- everybody countersteers, if they ride at speed. I just don't like the way he black-and-whites things. The full article makes the point just as well without resorting to exaggeration. There's other things- like

"Another recognizable error, resulting in excess effort used to steer the motorcycle, is the attempt to turn the bike by bulldogging the bars. An interesting combination of pulling up on one and pushing down on the other rodeo style, like bull wrestling. No, repeat No, steering results from this. None, zero, nadda, niente. Riders who think they can twist the bike into a turn in this fashion simply have another false idea and get tired. The Bottom Line"

Now, that's true, but the reason people think it works is because when you push down on the bottom bar, you also tend to push it forward- that's how I used to rationalise countersteering. If you say bluntly "You are wrong, that doesn't work", but people go away and do it and it seems to, you don't get your message across. Code expects people to just accept his statements- and even though he's right, that's not too clever. If people are wrong, you explain why, you don't just chuck it in their face and expect them to catch it.

[Balky001]

Originally Posted by Jelster

Ride down a straight road (with no traffic) along the centre line. Gently "jab" the right bar away from you and the bike immeadiately turns to the left and then back upright.

.

Jelster, if you push the right bar forward, it will lean to the right. Are you saying that although you are leaning to the right the bike goes left?

I think the best examples are speedway riders, full lock right to go left. Once you visualise that (without the sliding!) counter steering makes more sense

I agree that by polarising the discussion into 'right and wrong' is often not all that helpful, and any good instructor/educator would need to consider the pupils experiences and where there coming from before telling them what to do. But all I meant was that shifting weight around ON ITS OWN is of limited use on a runway let alone a road, and that everybody countersteers to turn. The problem here is that though we all do it, some people don't seem to be aware of it. C'steering seems to be a method of rapidly changing directions when you've overcooked a corner, or need to avoid something in your path. That's when some consciously C'steer out of the way etc. But if you are aware of doing it even for those gentle sweeps around corners then you feel far more in control, don't grip too hard, get less stressed, and you can control your progress with more finesse.
I don't think that the word 'rubbish' is helpful or warranted when applied to others posts.

[northwind]

Originally Posted by skidmarx

I don't think that the word 'rubbish' is helpful or warranted when applied to others posts.

Yeah, I'd agree with that. You suck, Flaming Squirrel

[northwind]

Originally Posted by Balky001

I think the best examples are speedway riders, full lock right to go left. Once you visualise that (without the sliding!) counter steering makes more sense

Do you ride on the road like a speedway rider?