Suzuki TL 1000 - Advice needed

About to return to the UK, and previously had a 2000 SV650S - want to upgrade to a bigger bike.

Really like the look of the TL1000 R, in GSX colours. Can anyone tell me what the bike is like, and what the difference is between the S and R models, and how the steering damper they fit to the bike affects control, and whether the tank-slappers are still an issue? Any advice on this bike, good points and bad, comparisons to the SV1000 or Honda Firestorm, for example, would be appreciated.

Thanks

if you pm irl_dar(something like that ) in the irish section he can tell you as he had the sv650s then went to the TLR, so ask him

[BoltonSte]

TLPlanet.com is your friend.............although some seem to be a little biased to the R. They're pretty friendly and some have had or still have both.

I do know the R has more power top end, and an hydraulic clutch.

Jiffypark.com also has some uselful TL stuff.

ste

[TSM]

http://www.tlplanet.com/forums/forum...?s=&forumid=57

This is the link directly to the UK section on TLplanet..

There seems to be a good amount of both S & R lovers in the UK, but many are out of london people.

Thanks for the tips - much appreciated.

I asked my learn-ed friend Dan (who I'm very glad recommended the SV to me when I wanted to learn to ride last year). Dan is also a TL owner and knows a bit about the TLs characteristics . His answer is below in case anyone has a similar question again in the future,

Again, this isn't my knowledge so don't ask me OK?!

Cheers,

C

"Difference between models/engine:
half faired TL-S has cast alloy lattice frame, fully faired TL-R has extruded beam frame. Both have unconventional rear suspension (more of which later) with a spring on one side and a separate rotary damper on the other. The TL-R engine has different cam duration and lift, aimed at higher peak power and less midrange - not by much though, '97 TL-S was 124hp at the rear wheel according to PB, and the TLR was about 130. Most people who have ridden both bikes agree TL-S is more entertaining - there may also be gearing differences. Midrange is what you need for fast corner exits and wheelies, and fast wheelies out of corner exits, intentional or otherwise.

Styling is a matter of taste, but the TL-S is unusual and spawned the original, pretty SV-S clone, the TLR looks like most other sportsbikes, but with a fatter ****. One point to note is that both the TLS and TLR have a riding position very much more committed and sporty than the sit-up-and-beg SV650S - I was shocked by how different it was when I first rode (your) SV, as I had always thought of the SV-S as a baby TL-S. With that in mind, don't be fooled by the similarity in styling, the TL-S was Suzuki's flagship superbike in '97, and the performance, ride and handling reflect that.

In engine terms, pick of the bunch is the '97 TL-S, most power out of all TL-S models, and still with all the mid range of the S. Later TL-S engines were reduced power (changes to camshafts and fuel/ignition mapping down to 110hp at the crank) in an attempt to tame it and improve it's reputation - all this did was spoil the best bit of the bike - the storming engine. 124hp at the rear wheel is not to be sniffed at for an 8yr old V-twin, it took Ducati years to match that and the Firestorm is way off - SP1 was about the same though.

Handling:
OE steering damper is absolute tos*. Junk it. For safety you can run with an aftermarket damper but the root cause of the stability concerns is the rear suspension, which you can fix if you want to. The rotary damper (fitted to the rear suspension of the S and the R) has far too much compression damping and not enough rebound. Bizarrely, the standard springing is also too soft, which does not compensate. Overall, the rear suspension is too stiff to react to irregularities on the road surface and causes the rear tyre to bear more of this task than it should. The 190 section standard rear tyre was specified for fashion and not handling, and worsens stability significantly. This is because a given amount of lean (or camber of the road) causes the contact patch to move further from the centre axis the wider the rear tyre is. (In extremis, a 190 tyre leant over to the edge has a contact patch centred 90mm or so away from the centre axis. By contrast the contact point of a knife edge is on the centre axis regardless of how far you tip it). This increased offset increases the side thrusts caused by irregularlities in the road under the rear wheel - a bump is just like lean, but with the bike upright and the road surface leaning. This is true for any motorcycle - where the TL-S fell down is that (in 1997 terms) it had a phenomenally punchy engine in a short wheelbase chassis with a steep steering angle, so is naturally prone to slappers. Add in the sub-standard rear suspension and the over wide rear tyre and you have an accident waiting to happen.

Some people (myself included) run without a steering damper as the feel and low speed handling is a lot better. If you fit a 180 rear tyre, an aftermarket damper and a stiffer spring, the tendency towards instability is reduced enough to allow you to ride it hard without a steering damper, even with the gearing dropped 10% such that it lifts the front over crests in third - not that I'd know, officer. That said, everyone's riding style is different, and I would always recommend taking it VERY easy if you ride one without the damper, even with the back end sorted. As much as anything else, a tense rider makes the stability worse, so far better to build up the pace gradually. If you're not used to a bike wagging it's bars gently under power and may be un-nerved by it (as opposed to a proper slapper which will rip your arms off and throw you down the road) then take it very easy until you're confident your riding and familiarity with the bike are up to it. A tense rider could turn gently wagging bars into a full blown slap-attack.

The TL-R was never accused of being slappy as it was fitted with the budget suzuki steering damper from day one. (It was a recall item for the '97 TL-S, standard from '98 onwards). There's a lot less discussion amongst TL-R riders as to whether the steering damper is required - most replace it with an adjustable aftermarket unit or leave it be.

FireStorm is an option, but less entertaining by a long way. Perhaps more forgiving and easier to commute on, but then so's an ER-5. I rode a FirePlace before I bought my TL-S and preferred the extra performance, razor sharp throttle response, less squidgy handling and more committed riding position of the TL. The attitude of both TL models is more comparable with the SP-1/2.

The SV1000 is a completely different proposition - it's a bigger version of the late-model SV650, and as such it's at the sporty end of all-rounder (or budget end of sportsbike, perhaps) rather than a true superbike - that's not meant as a criticism, merely a description of what to expect. I've never felt the desire to try one, so can't comment. Would imagine it feels like a budget FireStorm, with an even more upright riding position.

If you want to learn more about the TL, join www.thumperzone.com, where there are a whole bunch of helpful and knowledgeable peeps used to being asked just these sorts of questions, and technical articles on some of the common faults - clutch slip, coolant leaks and others, all of which are very easy and cheap to fix.

laters,
dan."